PSF: Schalke 04 0-0 West Ham Utd (6-7 pens) (02/08/14)

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claret parrot
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by claret parrot »

The_Cheadley wrote: surely a couple of wins against weaker opposition (for example some weak foreign team in a far away land) would do us the world of good?
That's a pretty good idea. Maybe next year we could organize a couple of games against teams from Australia or New Zea..... wait, I think I may have spotted a flaw in the plan.

no, your irony didn't escape me, as subtle as it was. :)
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by damiant »

On the whole I thought we looked a lot sharper than the games in nz. I did think nolan struggled with his movement. Downing seemed get the ball in to a dangerous position wide right but end up with no one to pass to. I dont think we missed noble in the slightest.
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by MD_HM »

The argument that Carroll would have won more headers or held it up better is a bit silly

We didn't have Carroll, we knew Cole was upfront so why play lofted balls to his head?

If you don't have the players to play hoof-ball then try something different, Cole playing alongside one of Lee, Zarate or Vaz Te might have worked better

The biggest problem is our second attacking position is wasted on Nolan, not much is going to change until we try something different
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Crouchend_Hammer »

carroll would have won more headers and helded up the ball for other players to get in support
Who would he have headed the ball to? There was no one near Carlton. He would not be able to control balls fired at his head

We don't need a new striker. We need to find a way of playing to get the best out of the ones we have
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by the pink palermo »

Ah excellent, we're back to the old two up top debate .

All Sam's sins would be forgiven if he simply caved in and played two strikers .
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by carnage »

the pink palermo wrote:Ah excellent, we're back to the old two up top debate .

All Sam's sins would be forgiven if he simply caved in and played two strikers .

Dont forget Avram got criticised for playing too many strikers at times.
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by the pink palermo »

carnage wrote: Dont forget Avram got criticised for playing too many strikers at times.
But back then results were what mattered whereas now we all know style is what counts .
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by SammyLeeWasOffside »

We have been launching aimless, no hope balls to an isolated Carlton Cole since the days of Zola. The poor sod spent years holding off 3 defenders while the likes of Diamanti and Parker didn't support him, now we ask him to try and do it while Nolan doesn't support him.
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by MikeNewell'sOldBoys »

Crouchend_Hammer wrote: Who would he have headed the ball to? There was no one near Carlton. He would not be able to control balls fired at his head

We don't need a new striker. We need to find a way of playing to get the best out of the ones we have
Agree completely. Carlton isn't a bad striker. I'd bet there will be worse players starting up front for other clubs in two weeks time.

Part of the problem is BFS his obsessed by stats. Apparently we created a lot of chances last season. Obviously that doesn't tell the full story. A floaty cross to our striker standing in the area surrounded by defenders isn't the same as a through ball played to a player through on goal in an Arsenal or Swansea game. They're half chances we're creating. Half chances that may end up in knock downs and deflections.
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by MD_HM »

the pink palermo wrote:Ah excellent, we're back to the old two up top debate .

All Sam's sins would be forgiven if he simply caved in and played two strikers .
No doesn't have to be two strikers

Sam's biggest weakness isn't his tactics or formation it's his loyalty to Nolan

If you don't play two forwards then the man between the striker and midfield is the most important

You need some to be able to carry the ball forward and hold it up not just hang about the 6 yard box looking for a tap in
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by the pink palermo »

SammyLeeWasOffside wrote:We have been launching aimless, no hope balls to an isolated Carlton Cole since the days of Zola. The poor sod spent years holding off 3 defenders while the likes of Diamanti and Parker didn't support him, now we ask him to try and do it while Nolan doesn't support him.
Poor old Carlton , loved by the fans , hated by his team mates .Probably the last to be picked every day in 5 a sides .

Is it because he's the longest in the shower ?
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Crouchend_Hammer »

Ah excellent, we're back to the old two up top debate .

All Sam's sins would be forgiven if he simply caved in and played two strikers .
I am not saying play two strikers. We can give the one we do play a lot more support without playing another one, by teeaking the formation. Bring the wide players inside and further up the pitch, get the player in the Nolan role more mobile and further up on occasions, and encourage one of the two defensive midfield players do get ahead of the ball once in a while.
Downing and famino were playing as wing backs in front of full backs yesterday and Nolan was miles behind Carlton.
We don't need two strikers, just more support for the lone frontman
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by carnage »

the pink palermo wrote:
But back then results were what mattered whereas now we all know style is what counts .
:scarfer:
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by hammerdivone »

carnage wrote:Dont forget Avram got criticised for playing too many strikers at times.
the pink palermo wrote:But back then results were what mattered whereas now we all know style is what counts .
We didn't get the results then either
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by carnage »

hammerdivone wrote: We didn't get the results then either

No but fans wanted him out because of the results. He was also labelled tactically inept on numerous occasions because when we needed goals all he did was "throw strikers on."
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Crouchend_Hammer »



But back then results were what mattered whereas now we all know style is what counts .

Grant got off relatively lightly compared to Allardyce given he was incompetent and we were bottom three all season, probably because we did try and attack, especially at home. That shows performances, or at least an intention to play attacking football, have always been important. Yes people wanted him out but there was not the same level of negativity towards him as there is Allardyce IIRC
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by SammyLeeWasOffside »

the pink palermo wrote:
Poor old Carlton , loved by the fans , hated by his team mates .Probably the last to be picked every day in 5 a sides .

Is it because he's the longest in the shower ?
Not hated just isolated. Its nothing new, its not a one or two up front problem. It is most likely a result of having to paper over the gaps in the quality of defenders and midfielders we have had
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by Anglingclub »

It may have already been mentioned, but was everyone else's picture on Quest absolutely ***** ?

It was like the old satellite pictures in the seventies from South America
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by the pink palermo »

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:
Grant got off relatively lightly compared to Allardyce given he was incompetent and we were bottom three all season, probably because we did try and attack, especially at home. That shows performances, or at least an intention to play attacking football, have always been important. Yes people wanted him out but there was not the same level of negativity towards him as there is Allardyce IIRC
:lol:

Coruchy you should have been on here then my friend , let me tell you about dear old Avram .

I was , by the end, the only poster on this site ( 17,000 registered users) that was defending him .I actually enjoyed quite a lot of the football under him - I'm not a pro so watching Obina fire it high wide and handsome from 35 yards was fun - we'd had a shot !

I got slaughtered on here pretty much 24/7 for the whole season .

Which is why I won't listen to others whining about the style of football these days .They got the Manager they deserved .

So you know , I was the first to call Sam out on here for style .We had just done Watford 4-0 away and I wasn't happy with how we had played .

The plain truth is for the vast majority of fans good football is when we win , crap football is when we don't .

Now, I've changed my mind on Sam as I can see a little bit more about what he has tried to do and the constraints that he operates in are signficant , so I'll cut him some slack , and i wish others would as well .
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Re: Schalke 04 v West Ham United: Match Thread

Post by claret parrot »

It's not even that though is it pp. I mean someone with a bit more mobility and creativity in the Nolan role who can link play and get quickly to those knockdowns - someone maybe like Mauro Zarate?

I just don't get it. On the one hand I say to myself "Who TF are you to think you might know better than one of the most experienced managers in the PL, you who don't even get to the games more than a few times a season?"

Then I look at the isolation of Cole and the ineffectual huffing and puffing of Nolan, and I'm thinking what is it he can see that that the rest of us can't, and does he really believe that it's working? Then I'm back to thing "Who TF.." rinse and repeat.
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