Swansea 1-1 West Ham Utd (10/01/15)

An archive of match day threads originally posted in the General Discussion forum.

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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby badgers1 on Sun Jan 11, 2015 9:40 pm

We_are_BML wrote:
Everton's winner was down to us committing men forward and getting hit on the counter


When the ball first went wide everybody was behind the ball apart from Carroll near the half way line and Noble a few yards outside the box. We had 8 players in or just outside the area when the cross came in. Getting hit on the counter was what WBA did to us a couple of weeks ago.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Crouchend_Hammer on Sun Jan 11, 2015 9:47 pm

Agree with that, Crouchy. Further, the likes of Hull/West Brom away were very similar games to yesterday - and that was a while back now


From what i remember, Hull away we were pretty gung-ho and open. same with Burnley. West Brom definitely not
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby poplargeezer on Sun Jan 11, 2015 9:57 pm

Just add to other posters here about the friendly welcome received in Swansea.
We had colours on and loads of different people at different places were welcoming and friendly.

A good away game - almost as good as 2 seasons ago when they had the beer festival on the same day!
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Romford on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:30 am

Poor tactics...scored from nothing....bit unlucky with the equaliser....Happy with point.

Our 5 at the back allowed Sigurdson more space to run the game...especially in the first half. No more please

Carrolls reaction was apparently down to gypsy remarks he always gets at the Liberty.

Very OTT stewarding in our end...must of been 30 people thrown out in a game that never had any problems before or after.

Good to see plenty of us out on the town after :thup:
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby WHUJohn on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:35 am

bubbles1966 wrote:Earlier in the year, we were scoring a goal and frequently getting a second one not that long after.

The second goal has started to disappear.


That's because we are playing better sides than we were then.

Swansea will finish top half, as will Everton, Burnley, Palace and so Stoke won't.

It's all relative.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Romford on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:39 am

RM6 wrote:
He wasn't even there today.


You'd know all about that.....
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Kendal Iron on Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:16 am

Burnley Hammer wrote:I honestly think we'd have beaten both Everton and Swansea if we carried on playing like we wanted a second, and not like we wanted to hold out for a 1-0. I really don't like it when we play too deep and invite attack after attack. Defensively, we're only good enough to hold out for so long before the opposition inevitably score.


Spot on. Handed the initiative to both.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby bubbles1966 on Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:33 am

WHUJohn wrote:
That's because we are playing better sides than we were then.

Swansea will finish top half, as will Everton, Burnley, Palace and so Stoke won't.

It's all relative.


There may be a degree of truth in that but Manchester City and Liverpool? The league table says that Everton this season are a poorer team than Stoke, and Swansea went for three not that long ago.

Big chances have been missed in the last two games, in particular. Swansea and Everton are no great shakes.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Knighter10WHU on Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:54 am

Thought we were very poor in the first half, but got much better in the second. Happy with the point in the end.

On another note, how poor was our end on Saturday? I don't know if its the layout of the stadium and the upper and lower split but I thought our atmosphere was dire, theirs was too bar the first 10/15 minutes in all fairness, but definitely one of the quietest West Ham ends I've been in for a while.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby WHUJohn on Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:25 am

bubbles1966 wrote:
There may be a degree of truth in that but Manchester City and Liverpool? The league table says that Everton this season are a poorer team than Stoke, and Swansea went for three not that long ago.

Big chances have been missed in the last two games, in particular. Swansea and Everton are no great shakes.


I thought you meant away games...

I'm not overly concerned as again I feel with massively over achieved in the first half of the season and think we can use games against Man City or Liverpool, where we most certainly over achieved, as a benchmark but shouldn't be judged when we fall short as that type of performance level just simply isn't going to happen week in week out throughout the course of the season as we aren't good enough as a squad.

We'll get two or more next week though..;)

We have made amazing progress this season though and although we won't and can't sustain that throughout the second half of the season, I think we are looking good for finishing 8th which would be superb.
Last edited by WHUJohn on Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby richneal on Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:25 am

Enjoyed watching the last 20 minutes or so - we look great when we get off the back foot and go for the win.
Also really enjoyed our two wingers who sometimes masquerade as full-backs - good luck to them both.

Moaning about stuff in hindsight is easy, but it would have been great to see us go for it about an hour or so earlier.

Couldn't give a monkeys if we leak goals, I'm after rip-roaring-goal-scoring entertainment. For the first time since Our 'Arry we've got elements of a squad that could be proper West Ham.
We need to have the desire and the guts to go for it. Make a gamble - see what happens.

Our Malcolm would be creaming his pants at Creswell & Jenkinson.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Estuary on Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:06 am

Overall a decent point, both sides had enough clear chances to win the game, its galling we way their goal came, Collins off and a mistake by Noble cost us. Swansea are a top half team who have only lost one home league game this season and to expect to be able to attack them as we please is naïve, we did as much attacking as Swansea allowed.
Not sure about the starting eleven, but overall that wasn't what cost us.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby MS in the West on Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:28 am

bubbles1966 wrote:
There may be a degree of truth in that but Manchester City and Liverpool? The league table says that Everton this season are a poorer team than Stoke, and Swansea went for three not that long ago.

Big chances have been missed in the last two games, in particular. Swansea and Everton are no great shakes.


Bubbles IMO you are a good poster [for what my opinion's worth :)]. But isn't this an example of how supporters respond to more wins by raised expectations. Then they express disappointment when previously unheralded advances are not maintained.

We're not as good as our league position of 4th/3rd suggested, nor to beat City or Liverpool regularly. We will have ups and downs and end up 8th-10th. We are building. I was disappointed not to win at Swansea - I think the aim was [minimum] a draw with the hope e could nick a win. At 1-0 we tried to shut up shop, and at 1-1 we could have won it. Swansea are only 3 points behind us, and Everton got into Europe based on last season. Established prem clubs. We're not good enough yet to take wins at their places for granted.

God forbid we ever develop, as a group of supporters, the sense of entitlement shown by Arsenal, ManYoo and Liverpool supporters
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby WHUJohn on Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:30 am

Spot on MS.. :thup:
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Turns to Stone on Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:41 am

The Premier League this year has shown that most teams can beat other teams on their day. After Leicester City hammered Man Utd, their fans started talking about top 10th finishes and they had threads on their forums about 'The Premier League Myth'.

When Southampton had their dip, people started talking about how they have returned to form etc.

West Ham are a decent mid-table side, we have a very organised manager who generally has managed to squeeze a few more points out of the sides he has managed. We have increased our expectations this year with some great results and a few surprise packages. The bottom line though is that everyone in this division is capable of beating everyone else. There are probably 8 teams above us who would always expect to beat us at home, and there are probably 10 teams below us who we would hope to beat at home. All other results though are something of a bonus if you ask me.

The only results I would say where we 'dropped' points this year were at home to West Brom and Villa. I would 'expect' us to beat both of those sides at home. Having said that, I wouldn't have expected us to beat Liverpool or Man City at home, nor would I have expected us to have got as many points on the road as we have this year.

We are over-achieving this year. Some fans are suggesting that Allardyce's tactics may end up scuppering our hopes of a decent finish, I would suggest that it was Allardyce tactics that have enabled us to over-achieve in this manner and now we are seeing some more realistic results.

Either way, it's a great season. And it's the managers job to try and manage results when the performances inevitably dip for a club of our quality. That's what I think we're seeing now.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby claretchris on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:04 pm

Turns to Stone wrote:We are over-achieving this year.


Spot on, as much as I'd like us to finish in a European place we just don't have the squad to deal with the extra games - I suspect it would lead to a pretty tough 15/16. Keep building slowly but surely :crest:
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Whufc06 on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:12 pm

This is not a complaint about Saturdays game before people jump on it but you cannot simplify games and points that we should've got by the opposition and league position. Everton last week, whilst a good result on paper, was disappointing given how the game panned out. It was definitely a missed opportunity. Same as Swansea. With the players they had out and the fact that we took the lead its gotta be 2 points dropped.
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Hambrosia Stu on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:21 pm

Burnley Hammer wrote:I honestly think we'd have beaten both Everton and Swansea if we carried on playing like we wanted a second, and not like we wanted to hold out for a 1-0.

Canadianhammer wrote:
We are pretty good defensively, I don't believe that's the problem. No team can afford to sit back and let the other team come at them.... if you do, the momentum of the game changes and you put the other team on the front foot. It's not rocket science.

I tend to agree
To my mind, you don't make the move to a more defensive set up, to see the game out, unless you are being over-run, and/or unless it's the last 5 or so minutes (plus the added time). I do feel that by making defensive changes with 15-20 mins to go, you can just hand the initiative to the opposition.
It is incredibly frustrating when that happens when we have previously been in relative control, and the opposition only gain momentum due to us sitting further and further back. That certainly was the case at Everton. They never looked like threatening us, imo, until we started sitting right back. It's fine to sit back and invite them on if you are looking to draw them forward to hit them on the counter attack, but to do that you need to leave decent counter attacking players on the pitch....

Against Swansea though, it was hardly all one way traffic. It was one of those games that could have gone either way. Sure, it is annoying to let a lead slip, and sure if anyone was going to win it it looked like it would be us, but overall I guess a draw ain't a bad result.

As for Nobes, sure he could have done better, but I do feel it's a bit harsh to criticise. It came at him quickly, and he just couldn't sort his feet out quick enough. It was one of those that if it had been on target (ie inside the post) he probably would have blocked it
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Romford on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:51 pm

MS in the West wrote:God forbid we ever develop, as a group of supporters, the sense of entitlement shown by Arsenal, ManYoo and Liverpool supporters


Was you there Saturday fella ?
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Re: Swansea vs West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Hambrosia Stu on Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:52 pm

Turns to Stone wrote:We are over-achieving this year. Some fans are suggesting that Allardyce's tactics may end up scuppering our hopes of a decent finish, I would suggest that it was Allardyce tactics that have enabled us to over-achieve in this manner and now we are seeing some more realistic results.

Whilst I do agree with the general tone of your post, I do think there is another aspect that needs to be mentioned. Better players.

If we are using last season's squad, and performances as the bench mark, then of course we are over achieving massively. But I do think you have to factor in that we are a different beast this season, and that is largely due to the improvement in the playing squad.

Playing Devil's advocate to some degree, but I do think you have to balance that against your comment about Sam's tactics. Sure, he does deserve credit, for coming up with the selections he did early in the season, and the balance in those selections. But I'd counter that by saying he probably wouldn't have made those selections had injuries not forced his hand, and that the improvement on last season, or over-achievement as you put it, has as much to do with having better players as it does anything to do with tactics. As much as it has in recent weeks, when the performances and results have dipped somewhat, as Sam's options have been lessened by injuries to key players. As a lot of the new players have been unavailable, we have fielded sides closer to the line up's of last season, and as a result the results and performances have been closer to those of last season than they were at the start of the season.

As such I do feel that, given how widely we improved our squad over the summer, we aren't massively over achieving. That's not me getting dizzy headed with altitude sickness brought on by our early league positions. I'm not for a second suggesting we are entitled to think we should be challenging the top 4. But I do think, when you look at our side when everyone is fit, and compare us to the rest, that we are where we are on merit, and the table does reflect how good we are, relative to the rest.

Us being 7th or 8th, I wouldn't call that a massive over achievement, on what I've seen so far. Seems about par for the course, if you are looking at the playing squads, rather than the name of the club. Of course maintaining that level over the rest of the season is another matter, and is largely dependant on us keeping our best players fit, but given our performances so far, it's no a false position we find ourselves in now (as it was imo when we were up in 3rd/4th place)
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