Crystal Palace 2-2 West Ham Utd (28/10/17)

An archive of match day threads originally posted in the General Discussion forum.

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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Estuary on Mon Oct 30, 2017 2:48 pm

Irrons wrote:We conceded a last minute equaliser because we are a mentally weak side. Despite Antonio's awful cross our team still let Palace run from their half to the edge of our box virtually unchallenged, on the 96 minutes mark, when we had enough players back to cover. We failed as a team, collectively, because no-one took responsibility.

This is a big part of the reason why Bilic needs to go


That gaping hole in our midfield had been there all second half, Fernadez and Lanzini may as well have stayed in the changing room at half time for all they did in the 52 mins that followed.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby wizzo_66 on Mon Oct 30, 2017 2:49 pm

First thing my father in law said to me yesterday was "How did Hart let that one in, appalling".

Probably unpopular given how well he played throughout the game - and he was excellent...but I tend to agree.

No point being excellent if he can't save routine stuff down low to his left.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby mushy on Mon Oct 30, 2017 2:50 pm

bubbles500 wrote:Completely amazing that the 4 players including Antonio,that not one of them gets back to our penalty area before the goal is scored.Antonio massively to blame but the other 3 as well.Total shambles,a non league team would have better game management.

The ball went to their keeper who through it out, Palace midfield had a 20 yard start, how the hell would anyone catch up with that?
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby mushy on Mon Oct 30, 2017 2:54 pm

Irrons wrote:We conceded a last minute equaliser because we are a mentally weak side. Despite Antonio's awful cross our team still let Palace run from their half to the edge of our box virtually unchallenged, on the 96 minutes mark, when we had enough players back to cover. We failed as a team, collectively, because no-one took responsibility.

This is a big part of the reason why Bilic needs to go

This is true, but has Bilic made them mentally weak?
Or are the players already mentally weak?
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby hoopsta on Mon Oct 30, 2017 3:13 pm

mushy wrote:

The ball went to their keeper who through it out, Palace midfield had a 20 yard start, how the hell would anyone catch up with that?[/quote]

from looking at the replay i noticed the ref busting a gut to catch up with play, after 10 secs our players still not in shot..
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Colours never run on Mon Oct 30, 2017 3:24 pm

wizzo_66 wrote:First thing my father in law said to me yesterday was "How did Hart let that one in, appalling".

Probably unpopular given how well he played throughout the game - and he was excellent...but I tend to agree.

No point being excellent if he can't save routine stuff down low to his left.



I did think the same, as I thought Btighyons first goal was also soft, because both efforts weren't right in the corner of the goal and not exactly hit hard. Some goals he let's in I do find myself scratching my head. Having said that, I won't give him grief as he generally had an excellent game and deserved MotM performance even if I wasn't happy with it.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Irrons on Mon Oct 30, 2017 4:32 pm

mushy wrote:This is true, but has Bilic made them mentally weak?
Or are the players already mentally weak?


Bilic's job is to help make the team mentality strong and to organise us to play as a cohesive unit. We play like a bunch of mentally weak individuals and it shows. It hasn't always been this way though and the core of the team has been similar for the last two seasons (Cresswell, Reid, Collinsm Ogbonna, Kouyate, Noble, Obiang, Lanzini, Antonio and Carroll). The only difference is that he seems to have lost the respect of the dressing room
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Kendal Iron on Mon Oct 30, 2017 4:37 pm

Irrons wrote: The only difference is that he seems to have lost the respect of the dressing room


Yeah, just what I was thinking when the 3rd went in at Wembley
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby irving boleyn on Mon Oct 30, 2017 4:51 pm

Beavis Danzig wrote:aside from everything else, hernandez and ayew look like a potentially lethal pairing. if the rest of the team even perform half decently we've got a chance of a result.


Totally thought the opposite !

Both finishers who need lots of chances made to show their worth. To have two such players in front of a sterile midfield is wrong

Poachers without sufficient bullets.

We can only start with Carroll plus one of these.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Irrons on Mon Oct 30, 2017 5:45 pm

Kendal Iron wrote:Yeah, just what I was thinking when the 3rd went in at Wembley


After yet another Jekyll and Hyde performance in the first half. There's no consistency whatsoever. If he hasn't lost the dressing room (questionable from my point of view) then he and his staff still aren't motivating and organising the team as they should. He isn't solely to blame for this but we can't change the players (until Jan at the earliest) and we won't be changing owners any time soon. He's the only thing we can practically change at the moment. If we keep performing like we are we will continue to leak goals and we will end up in a relegation dogfight, without a shadow of a doubt. I like Bilic as most do and will always remember the best season I've seen us have in recent memory (2015/16), but it really looks like his time is up here, and has been for a while. I'm dreading the Liverpool game
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Wilko1304 on Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:52 pm

irving boleyn wrote:
Totally thought the opposite !

Both finishers who need lots of chances made to show their worth. To have two such players in front of a sterile midfield is wrong

Poachers without sufficient bullets.

We can only start with Carroll plus one of these.


How many shots did Ayew have against Spurs? How many shows did he and Hernandez have against Palace?
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby gaptooth on Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:59 pm

bubbles1966 wrote:
Before this afternoon's games we were 8th for possession, shots on target and goals created in open play.....which implies that we are pretty decent in some ways.

We are the worst in the league for sending offs, penalties conceded and 'errors'.

It suggests that we need to slightly rebalance and actually spend a few bob in the defensive areas of the squad.

We've thrown away 5 points in the last few minutes of games v Palace, Southampton and Burnley. That's the difference between where we are and pushing for top 7.


I like this attitude.

My 10 year old daughter (rightly) called me out at half time against Spurs. She said that supporting the team meant cheering them on, not slagging them off. Turns out she had a point.

More of this positivity please. We need it.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby irving boleyn on Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:01 pm

Wilko.....Very few, Thats my point,, Pick two poachers and there are less providers of chances.

I guess you are saying Carroll plus one didnt work at Spurs? Okay but I think more chances will be made.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Beavis Danzig on Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:10 pm

irving boleyn wrote:Poachers without sufficient bullets.

We can only start with Carroll plus one of these.


they've got nine goals between them this season. that's nine more than andy carroll.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Up the Junction on Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:20 pm

TheRealHammer wrote:Just because they are individual errors doesn't mean the manager is off the hook. If I make an error at work it could be because the manager hadn't explained something correctly.

A strange analogy. I'm not aware of any football manager anywhere, ever, having to tell a defender not to trip an attacker in the penalty box.

TheRealHammer wrote:Saying they are individual errors and not the managers fault is completely wrong.

You forgot to write 'FACT'...
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Colours never run on Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:25 pm

Kendal Iron wrote:[


Yeah, just what I was thinking when the 3rd went in at Wembley



:thup:
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby irving boleyn on Mon Oct 30, 2017 10:05 pm

[quote="Beavis D

they've got nine goals between them this season. that's nine more than andy carroll.[/quote

But not when they've started together
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Sarfend Hammer on Mon Oct 30, 2017 10:30 pm

I think there is a direct connection with individual errors and poor management. Particularly when they happen with the frequency we are seeing.

There are teams in the league such as Watford and Burnley with much weaker squads who are able maintain concentration and commitment for the full ninety minutes. We on the other hand are now consistently finding ways to throw the game away particularly late in games.

The latest example being Antonio not holding onto the ball and letting the clock run down. I think his decision was not one born out of stupidity but more out of a lack of concern for the consequences of his poor decision. If he was playing for Morinho or Ferguson do you think he would have made that same decision. I doubt it because he would have been publicly lambasted and sat on the bench for the next month until he earned his manager’s trust again. Will that happen with Slaven? What were the consequences for the red cards for Arnautovic or Carroll? Back in the team immediately. How about Zabaleta and Ogbonna now?

The odd mistake here or there can be put down to individual errors, frequent mistakes would indicate a different kind of problem. We have that different kind of problem.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Doc H Ball on Mon Oct 30, 2017 10:55 pm

Sarfend Hammer wrote:
If he was playing for Morinho or Ferguson do you think he would have made that same decision. I doubt it because he would have been publicly lambasted and sat on the bench for the next month until he earned his manager’s trust again


I suppose one small difference might be that Morinho or Ferguson would've had a top class player in the first place and been able to replace them with a top class player for a month.
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Re: Crystal Palace v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby carnage on Mon Oct 30, 2017 10:58 pm

It's all relative. He is an average player and we have plenty of those to replace him with,
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