Watford 2-0 West Ham Utd (19/11/17)

An archive of match day threads originally posted in the General Discussion forum.

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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby The Sherriff on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:06 pm

Iron-worx wrote:The streams were appalling yesterday, worst ever, and I saw virtually nothing.

All I can comment on therefore is that I saw that we covered 10km more distance than our average for this season - It would seem that the workrate has improved even if nothing else has.


We also run 4k less than Watford.

Its an old team, they aren't going to be fit or play at the same intensity as younger teams.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Crouchend_Hammer on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:08 pm

We weren't great, but it was the first time this season thwir keeper has worked harder than ours

We created four very very good chances and were unable to take them. That is more 'clear cut' chances than any game I can remember this season

Defensively, still all over the place, but it was one of the better attacking displays (in terms of creating chances) have had this season - and that is with three of our better attacking players unavailable

we actually saw a through ball for the first time in ages and had a midfielder in the opposition box on occassions in open play. Both of those things haven't been seen for ages
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby The Sherriff on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:12 pm

mushy wrote:Martinez was in a side that got beaten 5-1 at home on Friday to an average under 23 Derby side. Am not sure this so called determination will work well for him in the Prem.
He looked like he was treading water the entire game, maybe its all this intense training?


Is this the same Martinez that scored one league goal in the 3rd division last season?
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby prophet:marginal on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:22 pm

hammers92 wrote:I actually thought Carroll’s 6 second challenge was a red, lucky boy


It wasn't just a red. If he'd done that anywhere else, he'd have been in handcuffs.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby il_martello_di_genovesi on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:24 pm

Colours never run wrote:4 clear cut chances, yet the same could be said about Watford who also failed to finish all their chances.

Depends on what you call clear cut I suppose. They scored two of theirs and Hart made a brilliant save for one of their others. I would've loved to have seen Ayew/Hernandez on the end of any of ours, but unfortunately that wasn't possible.

Reid was also absolutely ****ed and I'm not surprised after playing 2 games and travelling across the world twice, but Fonte and Collins are injured. The 2nd goal was the most blatant of handballs ever and should not have even happened.

We were shocking yesterday for the most of it I agree, yet with the chances we created we were still in the match up until that shocking piece of refereeing.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Hamburger on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:24 pm

.
When Watford were in possession they had so many passing options because our marking was abysmal. When we had possession we had hardly any options except sideways or back (again). Carroll cannot play as a lone striker, he does not have the speed or ball skills to take on defenders and is only good for heading and holding the ball. But as there was no-one within 20 yards of him he was totally ineffective. It’s also an indictment that none of our 4 good goal scoring opportunities were from him. Coupled with his snidey antics, he is a liability and should be sold imo so we can use the money to help buy players that we need, have pace and fit in.

We desperately needed Antonio to run at them, would have been a different game with him filling the void around Carroll. He is the key player for us at the moment imo, the only one we have with pace. I only hope Moyes gives him a bit more respect than Bilic did, who used him to fill holes rather than play him to his best advantage and preferred position.

I shudder at the thought of Vardy running at us on Friday and Mares dancing around our flat footed midfield. I daren’t even think about our other matches before Xmas. If we don’t beat Everton, where will any points come from?

Ever A
City A
Chel H
Arse H

Even if we miraculously get 6 points that means 15 points from 18 games, exactly the same number as Sunderland had in Jan this year.
.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby uptonparkhurst on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:46 pm

Yes, I thought we were rubbish, too - but bear in mind
1)Some of our "misses" were actually blinding saves by Gomes
2)On MoTD last night Hughes was embarrassed that the 2nd goal wasn't disallowed for handball
- all he could say was "No one appealed"!
3)For the first goal, Gray pushed a West Ham player under the ball then wildly mis-kicked it -
- straight to Hughes..
4)I'm not defending AC but, when he elbowed the Watford player in the face early on -
the player made no attempt to jump: no way was AC's elbow raised.
5)Yes, Reid was at fault for the 2nd goal, but he also single-handedly prevented a goal with a great block.

Having said that -
We may have covered more yards than in previous matches, but jogging speed doesn't count, in my book.
Watford pressed us hard at every opportunity - Lanzini in particular was always doubled-up on.We end up passing it across the back then going long - or to put it another way - relinquishing possession. When the full-backs go wide to try & get us up the pitch the opposition exploit the space in behind at pace.
Needless to say, when the opposition have the ball we give them all the time and space they need.
And, once again, we almost conceded seconds after getting a corner!

I don't think that even SAF in his prime, with a backroom staff of STB and Harry Houdini could improve
us much. We just have to rely on other teams being worse than us (again)..
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Clacton-ammer on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:47 pm

Jesus wept, that was poor :lol:

On a plus side, Moyes has them running more, and Arnie has decided to turn up at last. Plus, when we defend a free kick, team bonding of holding hands is a nice touch.

Jesus wept, we were poor! I have had to say that twice!

Just laughably bad, no cohesion, no pace, no moving off the ball, I saw players running into trouble as they did not want the ball, that has to be confidence.

My sweet baby Jesus, that was poor......

Love the "sack the board" though.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Iron-worx on Mon Nov 20, 2017 2:29 pm

The Sherriff wrote:
We also run 4k less than Watford.

Its an old team, they aren't going to be fit or play at the same intensity as younger teams.


That's only 400 metres per player less than Watford after an increase of 1km per player on our seasons average...

Something that might be expected given a team that's been upping the intensity of it's training for two weeks, getting there but not quite there.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Humbug on Mon Nov 20, 2017 2:44 pm

Beavis Danzig wrote:We've got better quality players than a lot of other clubs but imho Slav has not squeezed the best out of them and I think they don't have much faith in his tactical capabilities or game plan.

It won't matter how well Moyes (or any other top manager) is good with fitness, tactics, organisation. If you have a section of the squad half-heartedly playing for our club with eyes elsewhere, we will fail.
[/quote]

And your point is?

1. We do have better players than most other squads.
2. Those players didn't play or believe in Bilic
3. I don't regard Bilic or Moyes as 'top managers'
4. Even if we had a 'top' manager who is is a master tactician, expert in organisation and fitness , it doesn't matter if the players have faith in any of the latter if they don't want to play at West Ham.

The worst scenario is having both 2 and last part of point 4, which is what we had under Bilic (and only time will tell with Moyes unless we get rid of the non-committed players).
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Haggy on Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:38 pm

We created chances, but the passing was awful. No one looking to take players on with skill and the ball like a hot potato. We have some serious character deficiencies in this squad. No leaders on the pitch.

Andy Carroll is a complete liability and waste of space on current form.

What has happened to Creswell? Looks a shadow of the player of 2 years ago. That said, same could be said of many players (Lanzini, Kouyate & Obiang I am looking at you).

I am not a massive fan of his defensive prowess, but surely Arthur has to come in for the next game either at full back or LWB. His ability to keep possession and move us up the pitch should make a difference and get us playing higher up the pitch, rather than keep working the ball (slowly) across the back four and then back again followed by the inevitable and unsuccessful hoof to Carroll.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby richneal on Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:31 pm

Won't perform the inquest needed here but a couple of points to emphasize:

Carroll once again demonstrated he's a liability to the club.
Elbows and arms everywhere, firstly he's itching for a red, second, he is consistently engaging in dangerous play. Needs to be dropped from the starting line up immediately. IMHO he's a disgrace to the club.

Masuaku shows quick feet and pace yet again. Great first touch and consistently beats his man to get the byline to cross. If we need someone LM or attacking on the left flank he is it. He's still suspect defensively as a LB, so putting him in front of Cresswell is what we need if the manager decides we need someone to attack down the left. For me, as LM in a 4-4-2 with the likes of Sako and Chicarito up front would be interesting to see - especially if we had Antonio matching him down the right.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Gabers on Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:35 pm

you would expect a reaction to a new manager coming in.... nothing! we were awful and deserved to get beat! no pace, no confidence, no idea... what was Lanzini doing stuck out wide left? Obiang and Kouyate have lost the ability to play a square 5 yard pass and when they did it was across the middle of the pitch straight to opposition!

It was another frustrating awfully bad performance! Reid was awful (had half an excuse having just got back) Cresswell was ****! Hart was ****! Carroll was .... you get the picture!

Moyes got his tactics totally wrong!

I am sorry but I only see this season ending in relegation! the fans deserve better! the board must sell up! Now!
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Beavis Danzig on Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:38 pm

Gabers wrote:what was Lanzini doing stuck out wide left?


getting used to his brand new role. if he wants to be a no.10 in a moyes team he's going to have to grow another foot.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby HammerMan2004 on Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:39 pm

Gabers wrote:Moyes got his tactics totally wrong!


As I said earlier in the thread. He played exactly as Bilic would, lined up exactly has Bilic would have. If he wanted to change things he could have, he had Masuaku and could've played with wingbacks. He could have played two up top.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Aceface on Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:41 pm

I know he's just doing what he has to do, but being told by David Moyes to get behind the team feels so weird it borders on being an out-of-body experience. I think it's partly because I keep forgetting he actually is the manager of West Ham United now. Even typing that looks strange.

It must be what it's like to have a step-father move in when you're 13 and immediately start telling you to do your chores.
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby iLoveLasagne on Mon Nov 20, 2017 6:29 pm

What was being chanted to the tune of Cum On Feel the Noize?
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby Kev59 on Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:05 pm

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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby aaronhammer on Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:40 pm

iLoveLasagne wrote:What was being chanted to the tune of Cum On Feel the Noize?


So **** Off Gold and Sully
You took our ****ing money
And told lies lies lies
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Re: Watford v West Ham Utd: match thread

Postby LOS on Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:51 pm

aaronhammer wrote:
So **** Off Gold and Sully
You took our ****ing money
And told lies lies lies


Absolutely loved that. Hope thats on repeat at full volume in the bowl on Friday night. Akin to Billy Bonds' Claret Blue Army at the Villa Park Forest semi final :lol:
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