Mark Noble - West Ham Legend 500 up

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Crouchend_Hammer
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Crouchend_Hammer »

The question is why should thinking Mark Noble is a legend, a fantastic servant, a very good player (which I would say 95% of posters agree he is) be mutually exclusive of having the opinion he should not be an automatic choice next season?
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e17
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by e17 »

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:The question is why should thinking Mark Noble is a legend, a fantastic servant, a very good player (which I would say 95% of posters agree he is) be mutually exclusive of having the opinion he should not be an automatic choice next season?
I don't think there's anything wrong with having that opinion, it's more when it's not based on any circumstantial evidence that I disagree with it.

When people were digging Nolan out for slowing everything down or not improving play, I stood and watched a lot of the games in question, and despite him being a fantastic servant AND on his day a very good player, it was impossible to argue with those referencing what they'd seen.

With Nobes, there seems to be a more polarised group of supporters that are steadfast in their outlook on him on both sides of the fence.The balanced critical appraisals should be heard out just the same as the positive ones, but there are a few whose names will pop up and you can already tell that no matter the blokes performance that day, even a MOTM one, there's will be a disclaimer laden post.

As others have said, I suspect Nobes is the sort of lad who would sit on the bench if the team benefited anyway. He's that sort of footballer.
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Estuary
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Estuary »

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:The question is why should thinking Mark Noble is a legend, a fantastic servant, a very good player (which I would say 95% of posters agree he is) be mutually exclusive of having the opinion he should not be an automatic choice next season?
There are no automatic choices, that's a fallacy.

Noble's a legend due to his longevity and the manner in which he conducts himself, his performances on the pitch and to a degree because he represents the aspirations of all of us who support the club, local or not, to actually be picked to play for West Ham and also, and probably more so, to follow the likes of Bobby Moore, Billy Bonds and Alvin Martin, to be a good Captain of the team.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Ben »

getting harder to fit Noble in the team, some games though we look lost without him.
if only he could play right back
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Estuary
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Estuary »

getting harder to fit Noble in the team,

That's exactly what we need to be saying, it means the other central midfield players are coming up to Marks standard and shows the club is improving its squad. I have no problem at all if Fernandez or Obiang get in ahead of Mark on merit, that's football, and it'll be good for the club, but as Crouchie says, that doesn't mean Mark cant be a legend.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by the pink palermo »

Crouchend_Hammer wrote:The question is why should thinking Mark Noble is a legend, a fantastic servant, a very good player (which I would say 95% of posters agree he is) be mutually exclusive of having the opinion he should not be an automatic choice next season?
Football Managers are in the business of winning , or at the very least , not losing , football matches .

They don't have favourites, sentiment or blind spots .They pick the best team available to them in a given set of circumstances .

Noble gets his place on merit .
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Pango »

Think I posted this on here about a year ago but I think 'Legend' is a major over used word.

Legend = Moore, Bonds, Brooking, Peters, Hurst etc.

(Next level down) = Potts, Noble, Lampard Snr etc (great servants to the club basically)

:crest:
Crouchend_Hammer
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Crouchend_Hammer »

the pink palermo wrote:
Football Managers are in the business of winning , or at the very least , not losing , football matches .

They don't have favourites, sentiment or blind spots .They pick the best team available to them in a given set of circumstances .

Noble gets his place on merit .
I am not sure I get this point

A manager of a football club picks the team. Doesn't mean all supporters agree with it.

My point was merely that it is possible for a West ham fan to love Noble, but not think he should be in the 'first eleven'

Based on the squad we have now, my choice would be that he starts the season as first choice alongside Obiang. However, if we sign a 'proper DM' (which won't happen), then my opinion would probably change and i would like to see Obiang and AN Other. Wouldn't mean i love Noble any less. Similarly, if a Noble's indifferent form continues then I would probably want to see a change (even if only temporary). Again, it wouldn't mean I love Noble any less
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Estuary
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Estuary »

I am not sure I get this point
Crouchie, you used the term "automatic choice" which a lot of people use as a perjorative term, both PP and I feel isn't the reality, managers pick what they consider to be the best 11 to win the game regardless of who that player might be.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Aztec Hammer »

Pango wrote:Think I posted this on here about a year ago but I think 'Legend' is a major over used word.

Legend = Moore, Bonds, Brooking, Peters, Hurst etc.

(Next level down) = Potts, Noble, Lampard Snr etc (great servants to the club basically)

:crest:
If you go by that, no West Ham fan under the age of 30 or so can say they have their own West Ham legend that they experienced.

That seems unfair.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Burnley Hammer »

Aztec Hammer wrote:If you go by that, no West Ham fan under the age of 30 or so can say they have their own West Ham legend that they experienced.

That seems unfair.
Don't worry, that was just Pango's made up definition.

According to Oxford dictionaries...

Legend: An extremely famous or notorious person, especially in a particular field.
‘the man was a living legend’
‘a screen legend’

Therefore... if they're an extremely famous player/manager/etc within West Ham United FC, I think it's perfectly fair to say that they're a Club Legend.

If they're famous throughout the whole footballing world then you could say that they're a Football Legend.

etc...
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by sutts07 »

Aztec Hammer wrote:
If you go by that, no West Ham fan under the age of 30 or so can say they have their own West Ham legend that they experienced.

That seems unfair.
Agree, there have been many a legend in recent years, Dicks, Di Canio, big Alvin, Ludo, Cottee, Frankie Mac... even George Paris qualifies in my eyes.

I would call them all West Ham legends because they are. I also have no doubt that many a West Ham fan will call Noble a West Ham legend for years to come too, because he is.

What is unfair is to try and put anyone up alongside the likes of Brooking, Bonds and Moore. Those three sit on a totally different level.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by sutts07 »

Pango wrote:Think I posted this on here about a year ago but I think 'Legend' is a major over used word.

Legend = Moore, Bonds, Brooking, Peters, Hurst etc.
You have overused it by adding Peters and Hurst if that is the case.

A simple criteria to use, would you mention their name if you were deliberating over a best ever West Ham side. If the answer is yes, I would say that qualifies them.

Noble would not get into the team but would get a mention by most. Obviously there are some who just would not even entertain him getting a mention. That is up to them, but he would get a notable doff of the cap from me.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by bubbles1966 »

Moore, Hurst and Peters IS the West Ham Legend.

It's this club's finest day. The bit that sets us apart from everyone else.
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Pango
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Pango »

As I said at the start I think the word Legend is over used.

I like Noble as much as everybody else, he lives around the corner to me and I chat with him occasionally. He is a top bloke without doubt.

I just think Legend is over used as a phrase.

Devils advocate kind of question but .... would you class Steve Potts a WHU legend ? Whatever he is he has to be on the same level as Noble.

Regards the under 30s statement. I think Loyalty and the natural environment that the Agents' have created within football means that there will be fewer Legends at all clubs. Just unfortunate for the under 30s but that's life.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Colours never run »

Simpler way of getting to the heart of the 'legend chatter and that's to look up it's definition..

2. countable noun

If you refer to someone as a legend, you mean that they are very famous and admired by alot of people.
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Estuary
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Estuary »

bubbles1966 wrote:Moore, Hurst and Peters IS the West Ham Legend.

It's this club's finest day. The bit that sets us apart from everyone else.
100%.
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GreenIron
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by GreenIron »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-37725703" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Proud of them.
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by snooperpooper »

Pango wrote:Think I posted this on here about a year ago but I think 'Legend' is a major over used word.

Legend = Moore, Bonds, Brooking, Peters, Hurst etc.

(Next level down) = Potts, Noble, Lampard Snr etc (great servants to the club basically)

:crest:
Agree with this so not a legend but more a veteran
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Re: Mark Noble - West Ham Legend

Post by Kialos »

In the modern game it is exceptional for players to have the longevity of Noble at one club. It is a more notable achievement than players from an era when it was fairly common.

To my mind Noble is every bit as worthy of being called a West Ham legend as others players mentioned. In fact a couple of the names mentioned are based on England exploits in the main.

Make no mistake, he is the almost certainly last of his kind.
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