sutts07 wrote:Singapore built a stadium with fully retractable seats and didn't cut corners but our lower tier is actually far superior to theirs behind the goal in terms of viewing distance in football mode.
The original specification for the "state of the art mechanical retractable seating" was going to be similar to that used for the Singapore Sports Hub. The East Stand would have proper retractable seats for the lower tier and the middle in-fill seats would have been raised up on hydraulic lifts - a conversion process measured in hours rather than weeks:
w4hammer wrote:what happened to the digital wrap. Is it installed and if so how would I know!?
That got shelved when it was decided that it would be too low resolution and not provide any protection from the weather to the concourse (it was led diodes hanging on bits of wire). That got changed to a static wrap and "the largest digital screen in the universe"
Gunz412 wrote:
At the end of the day the owners aren’t too fussed about the demographic of the crowd.
It could be full of 57,000 Asian tourists for all they care.
The fact so many of us hate the place is a minor inconvenience that won’t make any difference until it hits them in the pocket and for that to happen it would it need a massive drop in ST sales next season which I can’t see happening unless we get relegated.
Depends what % you call a massive drop...But any business which alienates it's most loyal fans (sorry customers) is heading for trouble.
Once the novelty wears off it is the core support they will need to rely on....and they will lose a good percentage of them in May....whichever division we are in.
Back in 1992 our crowds dropped by 40-50% following the Bond scheme...they won't admit it but they must be very very worried where we go from here.
HHCD wrote:
Depends what % you call a massive drop...But any business which alienates it's most loyal fans (sorry customers) is heading for trouble.
Once the novelty wears off it is the core support they will need to rely on....and they will lose a good percentage of them in May....whichever division we are in.
Back in 1992 our crowds dropped by 40-50% following the Bond scheme...they won't admit it but they must be very very worried where we go from here.
spot on! I wonder if deep down the board are actually thinking they've dropped a massive bollock??
HHCD wrote:
Depends what % you call a massive drop...But any business which alienates it's most loyal fans (sorry customers) is heading for trouble.
Once the novelty wears off it is the core support they will need to rely on....and they will lose a good percentage of them in May....whichever division we are in.
Back in 1992 our crowds dropped by 40-50% following the Bond scheme...they won't admit it but they must be very very worried where we go from here.
I strongly suspect that there were far fewer season ticket holders as a % of support in 1992.
That feels significant in this debate. Support was a lot softer then in terms of variation of attendance numbers
The extremely expensive roof is the best part of the lot, but even then it isn't that practical as it doesn't shelter the lower tiers from rain and in parts has leaks in it. But some engineering feat nonetheless. Everything else is ugly and disjointed.
Actually that's not strictly true, some of the Exec boxes the majority of the serfs don't get to go in look fantastic. At least Karren got their priorities right.
bobbymooresbracelet wrote:
Not as f***ing silly as they look then are they.
For sale;
A homeless club renting a totally unsuitable venue.
A club which has alienated a sizeable percentage of its core support (sorry customers).
A club which still has a huge debt.
A club who's last transfer window was a disaster
A club in a relegation fight.
New owner needs to find land and build a purpose built football ground
New owner needs to win over sizable percentage of core support on and off pitch
New owner needs to service and pay off debt
New owner needs to invest large sums in the playing squad to keep PL status.
We were a more attractive purchase at the Boleyn
Looking F***ng silly aren't they.
Dagdave wrote:What's going on this stadium.left with 5 mins to go only to find the doors locked and a near riot in progress
In all my fifty odd years never known anything like it ,
Do they want another hills borough absolutely disgusted
This club is in meltdown
Johnny Byrne's Boots wrote:If this article is true, and there's no reason to believe it isn't, it raises a very serious safety question. Is it even legal for exit gates to be inoperable when the stadium is occupied?
The issue with the doors still being locked before the end of the match is far more serious when you read the account from someone about what was actually happening and how decisions taken by LS185 turned a potential serious situation into an actual serious situation by sending in a response team to deal with the fans rather than opening the doors!
kllblq on SkyscraperCity forum wrote:
Firstly, let me just say, I really want this stadium situation to work but it's not. I am a west ham fan and you know what we are used to this kind of display over the years. I need to vent sorry!!!!
However here come another BUT
After 3- 0 down I decided that I had enough of this melee that is west ham this season and wanted to leave. To my horror all the exits were locked. This was on 80 + minutes. There was one girl on the door and she was powerless to do anything. Everyone was saying open the doors to no avail. What was very worrying is I can see more and more 'customers' coming down the stairs and joining the hoards of patrons wanting to leave and not being able to. At one point I thought I may need to go into the toilets to avoid what I thought was going to be an inevitable crush. The steward at this point look scared to her whits. I tried to use another turnstile and it was also shut with ever more people swelling the crowd. The steward on that turnstile opens what I assume was a disable entrance; that is 1 manual door to let people out. Then instead of the doors being opened. Stewards turned up ready for a fight. Astonishing!!. There were people calling for her and them to radio up to get the doors open and they could not and she could not because she did not seem to have radio contact.
I am assuming that at that point It was noticed on cameras to when battles stated between stewards and absent minded fans all this time the doors are still closed. How can a gate be manned my 1 and I mean 'one individual. There seem to be again no relation as to what goes on in the game to what the crowd are in-acting
What was worrying was misinformation being carried to the control room by the stewards not that there was congestion at the gates but that there was aggressive fans eventually leading to minor skirmishes.
Just to make sure it's clear what I personally experienced.
1 - One steward was manning to door with no radio contact to tell the control room that fans were leaving.
2 - Fans were asking for the doors to be opened to which she could not respond. Failing that we checked to see if we could use the adjacent exit but that was locked. There were already as many fans trying to leave in that exit via a single door to the side so we returned to the original exit.
3 - Someone somewhere was watching all this on cameras as a slant film and thinking that the jesticulating to the steward to open the doors was a treat to her safety. There must have been a command to go sort it out to which the heavies arrived all pumped up behind us in an attempt to misguidedly protect the steward.
4 - In the resulting commotion where everyone was shocked at what the stewards thought was fans wanting to fight the steward another woman turned up to protect her then realised when she started listening at the point to everyone continuously shouting open the door.
5 - By this point the heavies were already pushing people around and the gate which were still locked for around another minute or so. Only then did the woman rang up to say people wanted to leave and the doors miraculausly open all at once and everyone dispersed.
The problem I witness is when the steward saw fans steaming down the stairs she and probably the others could do nothing as she did not have a radio to tell the control room open the doors people are leaving. Where the woman who did who eventually turned up was I don't know because I did not see any of them at that point.
My guess is they were too busy at the away end which was not far away concentrating on the Arsenal supporters and were caught off guard by the sudden rush to the exits after the third goal.
I have never ever seen this at Upton park. The stewards who manned the gates tended to be there throughout the game. There were no stewards outside.
The last time I went the doors were opened at half time to let smokers out.
There was a separating partition on the concourse next to the Arsenal section which was open and it was from that direction the heavies and the woman came from.
I hope someone who is responsible for the security and more importantly safety reads this. Its the first time I have been in a stadium where I had to map the area to see where I can escape any potential danger.
LS185 are continually showing that they are not fit to manage football matchday operations. Such lack of experience of dealing with football crowds is now causing real issues of safety rather than just their continued ability to piss off a large section of the support. Such incidents will cause the SAG to review the safety certificate potentially reducing the attendance numbers rather than increasing it.
The ability of LS185 to open the doors remotely from a control room is completely irrelevant if the person in charge of the opening is in no position to do anything, or if the remote wiring and control systems have been rendered inoperative.
Something like a fire or terrorist attack could cause either or both scenarios.
That is the $64,000 questions or another club porky
So said Angus Kinnear in the SAG minutes (the link to them is on Kumb somewhere), stated they'd moved fans to the singing area that weren't happy in their seats
Plus apparently we now have a family area somewhere too !!!
I'm very concerned about these reports of stewards being unable to open exit gates and have sent to following email to Ben Illingworth at West Ham:
Dear Ben
I have been extremely concerned to read from various sources on West Ham supporters forums of problems occurring at the Arsenal match when fans attempted to leave early and found exit gates were shut.
It is hard to believe that after Bradford and Hillsborough a Premier League football club can allow a situation where exit gates cannot be immediately opened, where a steward manning the gate apparently has no means of opening it herself, has no radio contact to get the door opened and the system seemingly relies on a computer to open the exits.
For your information, below I have copied various posts and articles from forums which describe the potentially very serious problems. I hope that you are aware of these problems and that action has been taken to resolve them. If they cannot be resolved by Wednesday I believe that the situation described is potentially so serious that the Burnley match should be postponed.
I have copied the Football Supporters Federation and WHUISA with this email and hope that you can assure us all that for all future matches the stadium will be safe for supporters.
Thank you.
Best Regards
Can I suggest that if UTJ was to run this issue as a story on KUMB the media would pick it up and that might prompt rather faster action from the club.
