Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Does exactly what it says on the tin - the forum for football-related discussion.

Moderators: bristolhammerfc, sicknote, -DL-, Rio, Gnome, chalks, the pink palermo

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby sutts07 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:41 am

The security checks were as strict as I have ever seen as was the police presence. That tells you that West Ham, London Stadium and the Met were all fully aware of the potential for violence. Let's be honest, this is something we all knew.

It was a massive day out for Birmingham and they were full of intent. Our lot were fully aware of it and were also all out in force.

Despite that, whoever is calling the shots (ask the police and they shrug and say London Stadium are, which is unbelievable really) decided it would be a good idea to walk the full contingent of Birmingham fans directly into the path of the West Ham fans making their way home via Carpenters Road. I can't believe anyone is really surprised that it went off. The worst thing about it is that so many families, kids, OAP's and people with no interest in that type of thing all get caught up in it. On both sides...!

There has to be another route that away fans can be taken away from the stadium. Pudding Mill Lane seems the obvious choice.
User avatar
sutts07
 
Posts: 8632
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Block 112, a far cry from CR1

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby Knighter10WHU on Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:52 am

^^^ Sutts, me and the old man were saying exactly this on Saturday. There has been a few occasions where the home and away fans clash at that flash point down by the Carpenters. Spurs when we beat them 1-0 with Lanzini scoring instantly springs to mind.

There's also another flash point where if you are coming from the West Stand you can go down the loop road towards PML which is what we did on Saturday. You are literally walking directly into the bridge where the away fans exit the stadium. Surely it would make sense to shut that route off to home fans and send all the away fans back to PML (they do anyway for the away coaches) get them all on 1/2 DLR trains back to Stratford and onto a tube/train back into central and escort them out? Certainly for the higher profile games this should be for IMO.
User avatar
Knighter10WHU
 
Posts: 2816
Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 10:22 pm
Location: Berkshire.

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby ornchurch ammer on Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:16 am

sutts07 wrote:The security checks were as strict as I have ever seen as was the police presence. That tells you that West Ham, London Stadium and the Met were all fully aware of the potential for violence. Let's be honest, this is something we all knew.

It was a massive day out for Birmingham and they were full of intent. Our lot were fully aware of it and were also all out in force.

Despite that, whoever is calling the shots (ask the police and they shrug and say London Stadium are, which is unbelievable really) decided it would be a good idea to walk the full contingent of Birmingham fans directly into the path of the West Ham fans making their way home via Carpenters Road. I can't believe anyone is really surprised that it went off. The worst thing about it is that so many families, kids, OAP's and people with no interest in that type of thing all get caught up in it. On both sides...!

There has to be another route that away fans can be taken away from the stadium. Pudding Mill Lane seems the obvious choice.


That route has been a flashpoint since day 1 and there have been a number of incidents there although mostly it is verbals and bouncing. Even Wolves this season caused a nit of lairiness. I'm a little surprised it happened this week though as I left a few minutes early and the whole area under the Carpenters Bridge was absolutely mobbed with police as I went through.

Given what we have to put up with at certain away games, including Birmingham, I don't see why the away fans are not escorted to West Ham station. A bit of a walk to expend some energy and then in to the station where they can disperse 4 ways. If not then up to Bromley by Bow as that is nice and out of the way.

Why close off PML for away fans only?
ornchurch ammer
 
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:49 pm

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby Colours never run on Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:17 am

The took the Brum hoolies past the Carpenters?? :lol:

****ing idiots running the operation from top to bottom. Zero savvy.
User avatar
Colours never run
 
Posts: 11931
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 2:46 am
Location: "Be in no doubt, we are part of the most successful stadium migration in history"

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby sutts07 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:32 am

Knighter10WHU wrote:Surely it would make sense to shut that route off to home fans and send all the away fans back to PML (they do anyway for the away coaches) get them all on 1/2 DLR trains back to Stratford and onto a tube/train back into central and escort them out? Certainly for the higher profile games this should be for IMO.


Absolute no brainer to stop the home fans using PML until the away fans have cleared. Would take 30mins max.

The only downside would be the number of fans on the central line platform. That would require London Stadium, West Ham, The Met and TFL all working together, but other clubs (notably Millwall) do it to ensure fans safety.

With central line trains coming through every few minutes (capacity of around 1,000 per train) and a huge DLR platform to use as a holding pen, it wouldn't take long to clear fans away from the immediate area at all, and without coming into any kind of contact of the home fans.
User avatar
sutts07
 
Posts: 8632
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Block 112, a far cry from CR1

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby davids cross on Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:33 am

Wrong thread muppet.
User avatar
davids cross
 
Posts: 24510
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 10:20 pm
Location: Crawley, West Sussex.

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby sutts07 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:41 am

Colours never run wrote:The took the Brum hoolies past the Carpenters?? :lol:

****ing idiots running the operation from top to bottom. Zero savvy.


They take the full away support all the way along 'Loop Road' and off behind the Aquatic Centre (let's call it the swimming pool) which crosses Carpenters Road but they don't take them under the bride and along Carpenters Road past the pub anymore (they learnt that lesson in our first cup game against Chelsea).

You get various points at which both sets of fans are either face to face or directly above / below each other, then the real flash point comes where they have to cross over each other at the Carpenters junction (West Ham wanting to walk along Carpenters, away fans being taken along Loop).

It is absolutely ridiculous and totally avoidable if away fans are taken to PML.
User avatar
sutts07
 
Posts: 8632
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Block 112, a far cry from CR1

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby ornchurch ammer on Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:49 am

Or away fans are walked along the greenway to West Ham.

Every else it is the away fans that are inconvenienced. Why should we be different?
ornchurch ammer
 
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:49 pm

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby sutts07 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:01 pm

ornchurch ammer wrote:Or away fans are walked along the greenway to West Ham.

Every else it is the away fans that are inconvenienced. Why should we be different?


West Ham is about 30min walk, that is a bit harsh.

It is a 9min walk from the away exit to PML. We could clear the full away support in less than 30min without any risk of confrontation or without really further inconveniencing any home fans.

Away end to PML

Away fans currently leave via bridge 4 (which is closed off for home fans anyway) and walk straight past PML before going all the way round past the swimming pool. It makes no sense at all. Just get them on a train at at PML and get them out of the way, it then becomes at Met and TFL issue.

Image
User avatar
sutts07
 
Posts: 8632
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Block 112, a far cry from CR1

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby Phil S on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:16 pm

^

I can't find it at the moment but the Met have dismissed PML as not suitable for away fans

and to be honest if they did and held up West Ham fans as they did on Saturday, I really think I'd jack in going.
edit
Found it

Met Police West Ham Utd FC
‏ @MPSWesthamUtdFC
2h2 hours ago
Replying to @Mrs_R_Swipe

PML could not cope with that amount of supporters nor could Hackney wick.
If we redirect them to the front of the station this would cause the station to close, and create additional flashpoints.

Like i have said we will review what we do and how we do it.
User avatar
Phil S
 
Posts: 4709
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:57 pm
Location: Sarfend

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby BethnalGreenHammer74 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:26 pm

I just don’t understand why the police didn’t keep the Birmingham fans in for 30 mins after the match ended? Why did the police let them cross infront of the westham fans which ended in trouble? Someone has to be held accounted for this as it’s going to end in someone getting seriously hurt, or even worse.
It’s strange how the away teams are willing to have a pop at West Ham fans all of a sudden, when most clubs wouldn’t have made a noise outside of Upton Park. So surely this has to do with there escort after the game, which walks them straight into the West Ham fans? And to me, this is the police is fault?
BethnalGreenHammer74
 
Posts: 37
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2016 1:58 pm

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby NorthernIron on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:27 pm

Nels wrote:As a 65 year old white male I was asked to remove my hat with crossed hammers on it at the bridge checks as well as the pat down , to which I don't have a problem.
But then going through E turnstile I was asked to remove my hat and leave it off until I got to my seat.
Bearing in mind how cold it was and ive got nothing else on top to keep my head warm , I refused and asked ,why ?, the supervisor shrugged his shoulders and said that's what they want , so if given a valid reason it may have helped.
As I had removed it once already ,a pointless exercise apart from winding up your paying customers .


Nels, hope you're ok after that experience.

WHUISA have received a number of reports over the quality of stewarding which we are taking up with LS185/E20. We will also be raising this at the Police IAG meeting this week.
User avatar
NorthernIron
 
Posts: 525
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2016 2:50 pm
Location: info@whuisa.org

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby NorthBankAlliance on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:30 pm

BethnalGreenHammer74 wrote:I just don’t understand why the police didn’t keep the Birmingham fans in for 30 mins after the match ended? Why did the police let them cross infront of the westham fans which ended in trouble? Someone has to be held accounted for this as it’s going to end in someone getting seriously hurt, or even worse.
It’s strange how the away teams are willing to have a pop at West Ham fans all of a sudden, when most clubs wouldn’t have made a noise outside of Upton Park. So surely this has to do with there escort after the game, which walks them straight into the West Ham fans? And to me, this is the police is fault?


Few easy nicks, and a justification for old bill overtime I'd imagine is the reason behind what they do!

Don't worry I'm sure PC Sheldon will sort it out in time :asleep:
NorthBankAlliance
 
Posts: 2622
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 11:21 am

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby Colours never run on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:37 pm

BethnalGreenHammer74 wrote:I just don’t understand why the police didn’t keep the Birmingham fans in for 30 mins after the match ended?


They let them out very soon after out lot left? Dear oh dear. Who's in charge, Capt. Harris?
User avatar
Colours never run
 
Posts: 11931
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 2:46 am
Location: "Be in no doubt, we are part of the most successful stadium migration in history"

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby sutts07 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:46 pm

Phil S wrote:PML could not cope with that amount of supporters nor could Hackney wick.


Not having a pop at you here as I know you are just re quoting but I just don't believe that at all. It just takes some solid organisation. I have lost count of the number of times we have been penned together outside a tiny station and put onto trains holding less then 300 passengers to disperse us all. It is an effective tactic to be honest.

You send a DLR train full of away fans to Stratford, hold them on the DLR platform and wait for another one or two sets to arrive. Within ten mins you have close to 1k away fans that can be put on a central line train together so you temporailly shut access to the west bound central line platform (the vast majority of our fans will be going the other way anyway). Repeat that a few times and you are done.

A quick google search alone tells you that DLR trains, as small as they are, run at five min intervals and hold around 300 people. You could certainly get most away followings off to Stratford in a 30 min window.

Admittedly there is more of an issue when 5k turn up for a cup game but I also assume a large number of those could come via club coaches with enough collaboration between the clubs and police. After all, it is all about trying to guarantee fans safety. Burnley and Blackburn bus fans in for derby games. Cardiff have been forced to do it coming to us before too.

Phil S wrote:Like i have said we will review what we do and how we do it.


Good that they are looking into it. There is clearly a major issue / concern.
User avatar
sutts07
 
Posts: 8632
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Block 112, a far cry from CR1

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby Phil S on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:55 pm

^

solid organisation..

I was stood talking to a couple of met guys and they just said it's been 3 years and they still haven't got a clue how to deal with it.

I guess really it's only a few games a season where they are high category.

I use PML every game, if that means waiting behind then I'll stop going. I'm not doing the stop start to Stratford every week.
User avatar
Phil S
 
Posts: 4709
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:57 pm
Location: Sarfend

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby sutts07 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:55 pm

Colours never run wrote:They let them out very soon after out lot left? Dear oh dear. Who's in charge, Capt. Harris?


They let them all out instantly... At the same time as the home fans!

In fact they hold back (restrict) the home fans who are leaving Gate C and want to walk left towards bridge 4 or 5. It is blocked off for at least 30mins. That, despite it being the main (maybe only) route that disabled fans can take to get the lift down to the car park below. You honestly couldn't make it up in terms of how far down the list we rank in terms of priorities.

Home fans from 112-114 etc wanting to go home via Carpenters Road have to walk pretty much a full lap of the stadium just to get to a bridge they can use. They then walk out past the orbit and down towards the bridge leading to Carpenters Road where guess what... the full contingent of away fans (who they were not allowed to mix with leaving the stadium) are now being marched towards them via Loop Road...

It is absolutely bonkers.
User avatar
sutts07
 
Posts: 8632
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Block 112, a far cry from CR1

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby sutts07 on Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:01 pm

Phil S wrote:I use PML every game, if that means waiting behind then I'll stop going. I'm not doing the stop start to Stratford every week.


Fans who use entrance A B and C and want to get back to Stratford are made to wait for at least 30mins every single game as it stands. Either that or walk a full lap of the stadium which in crowds can take almost as long. This includes disabled fans who want to use the lift down to the car park at Bridge 4.

We just have a quick beer in the stadium most weeks and let it all die down / open up. No big deal, certainly not something I'd stop going to watch West Ham over.
User avatar
sutts07
 
Posts: 8632
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Block 112, a far cry from CR1

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby Phil S on Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:05 pm

I exited from C last season turned right (the wrong way) then crossed bridge 3 and turned left and walked towards PML where we always bumped into away fans (a flash point for sure) but only Chelsea and WBA were a bit fruity.

DO they close bridge 3 now post game?

I use E now and it's ok all the way to PML and we only see away fans really from above as we walk up to Greenway. (other than Saturday where the police blocked us until the Brum fans had walked past.
User avatar
Phil S
 
Posts: 4709
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:57 pm
Location: Sarfend

Re: Olympic Stadium Discussion and Questions

Postby ornchurch ammer on Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:06 pm

sutts07 wrote:
West Ham is about 30min walk, that is a bit harsh.

]


So? How long is the walk (escort) from St Andrews to New St for example? And that is after being held behind to allow the home fans to clear (congregate on route).

PML cannot cope with the numbers and they will never shut the westbound platform, or any platform, at Stratford as that will affect normal people as well as football supporters.

To me, with high profile games, walk them to West Ham. In addition to the number of lines there the longer they are in an escort the more time for home fans to disperse and less chance of opportunistic trouble.
ornchurch ammer
 
Posts: 182
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:49 pm

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Cellar-door, Cuenca 'ammer, Google [Bot], HamburgHammer, Lil Joe 17, stouffer, Tarte Encore and 23 guests