The Big 6

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Re: The Big 6

Postby Ozza on Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:48 am

bubbles500 wrote:The thing is if a super league were formed.Im sure Spain and Germany wouldn’t accept England having 6 teams in it.Pretty sure Germany and Spain have a bigger overall coefficient.I also doubt all our top 6 are in Europe’s top 20 coefficients although I might be wrong.The most I could see would be 4,and how they’d work that out who knows.


Bubbs would the leagues get a say in it though, I doubt they would? As for the clubs, I doubt they would give a monkeys where the other clubs were from as long as the money was good
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Re: The Big 6

Postby BondsoBob on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:01 am

A quick question. Just when did the 'big 4' become the 'big 5', and when did the 'big 5' morphe into the 'big 6' ?
And just who makes up all this nonsense. As I said before, it's all a load of bollox. :o
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Re: The Big 6

Postby sutts07 on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:06 am

BondsoBob wrote:A quick question. Just when did the 'big 4' become the 'big 5', and when did the 'big 5' morphe into the 'big 6' ?


It started to happen around the time that Chelsea, and then Man City accrued more spending power than Liverpool and Arsenal.

It was then compounded when Man Utd finished outside of the top four.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby BondsoBob on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:19 am

Originally, the term 'big 4,5, or 6' or whatever, started sometime in the early 80's. If my memory serves correct the original 'big 5' were, Man United, Liverpool, Tottenham, Arsenal, and Everton.
And again, if my memory serves correct, when a 'Premier league' was first mooted around 1986/87 it was to consist of 12 clubs who were : Man United, Liverpool, Everton, Arsenal, Tottenham, WEST HAM, Aston Villa, Nottingham Forest, Sheffield Wednesday, Newcastle, Sunderland, and Man City. Not a sniff of Chelsea. Just shows you how things can change.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby bubbles500 on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:42 am

This is an excellent point. It's entirely possible that Man City and Spurs wouldn't get in given their lack of established European credentials - a point that seems to be missed so often when this empty threat is made.
[/quote]

Tbh spurs have more credentials than Arsenal who have never won a European trophy in their history,a truly astonishing fact.Spurs Just creep in with a European coefficient of 20 th.Liverpool are 35th.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby bubbles500 on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:44 am

In fact the arsenal stat is wrong.No idea where I got that from.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby sicknote on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:45 am

Arsenal won the fairs cup and cup winners cup

In 70 and 94
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Re: The Big 6

Postby HeadHammerShark on Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:34 pm

[quote

Tbh spurs have more credentials than Arsenal who have never won a European trophy in their history,a truly astonishing fact.Spurs Just creep in with a European coefficient of 20 th.Liverpool are 35th.[/quote]

Sorry, to be clear by "credentials" I literally just mean that they've been part of the Champions League cabal for a lot longer and will therefore be better connected with the other clubs trying to destroy competition. I doubt anything irrelevant, such as how good the team is at football, would be a consideration in the composition of an eventual Super League.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby Patito on Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:47 pm

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Re: The Big 6

Postby fmgod on Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:55 pm

It's not really a big six though is it, Manchester United are miles ahead in the last twenty years(as a club, stature), Chelsea are getting there, City are trying at the minute, Arsenal seem to just be dwindling along, Liverpool are nothing currently amongst the big teams and Tottenham are trying to crack in,
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Re: The Big 6

Postby TheHandOfDog on Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:59 pm

I hope the big 6 leave. The league would be more open and anyone could win the title. I'd love to watch the faces on all those clubs fans as they have to travel abroad every other week across Europe to watch their side.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby Estuary on Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:00 pm

In terms of the move to a merit based payment system, that's just lining up with the distribution of domestic TV prize money. But of course it benefits those clubs currently finishing in the higher placings which would tend to act to perpetuate the few that win the league.
The lure of the Premier League is in its depth, a dilution of that will see the international values fall.
The top six in England are equivalent in Euro terms to the 6-12 in the PL, so I cant see why they would look to a Super League in preference to the PL, they would become also rans, which is surely not the aim.
Last edited by Estuary on Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby Clucking Bell on Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:02 pm

I would have thought that most of the pressure for any kind of European Super League comes mostly from Europe. Among the PL clubs, I'd bet that the drivers are Man U, Liverpool and Arsenal: those clubs with American owners who think that they've bought an NFL-style franchise.

The Premier League is reasonably competitive and even though Man U have won as many times as everyone else put together, most of their success came before Chelsea and City won the lottery too. You've also got the relative declines of both Liverpool and Arsenal and the fact that the likes of Everton and us are a Payet or two away from making the Top Six the Top Eight.

European football is a lot less competitive. La Liga is a two horse race, Juventus has romped home for the last five seasons or so and it's always a bit of a shock if you look at the Bundesliga table and Bayern aren't on top.

I think the only fans that would enjoy a Super League would be Americans as we'd finally have an NFL-type contest i.e. one in which losing has no consequences and you can be as **** as you like for as long as you like and you still pick up a big cheque every year.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby Crouchend_Hammer on Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:10 pm

Exactly Clucking Bell - the really big clubs in Europe (Real, Barca, Bayern, Juve and PSG), know that their domestic leagues are poor in comparison to ours (from a competitive point of view)

They want more of those really big matches that their leagues cannot provide

People can moan about a 'top 4' or a 'top 6' all they want, but it is a lot better than a 'top 2' or even a 'top 1'
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Re: The Big 6

Postby Estuary on Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:16 pm

romfordneil wrote:If the big 5 and Spurs want to leave then let them go. Let's see how Arsenal & Liverpool fans react when they finish 13th -16th year after year in some Euro Super League. It wouldn't bother me in the slightest if they were replaced by the likes of Leeds, Villa, Forest, Sheffield Wednesday & Wolves.


This, exactly this.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby asters89 on Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:50 pm

I don't mind having a big 6 so much, it's at least and improvement over the big 4 that I remember from about 10 years ago (before City were mega rich and Spurs were good).

At least this way at least two are going to miss out on CL qualification through the top 4 which makes it a bit more interesting.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby AnthraxDave on Thu Oct 05, 2017 7:58 pm

IMHO, tell these "Big 6" clubs to shut up or sod off.
If they choose the latter action, they should me made aware that when (not if) the super league jobbie implodes, they would be able to re-join the English football pyramid at local/regional level (Step 5 of non-league).
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Re: The Big 6

Postby Boleyn Bill on Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:01 pm

sicknote wrote:Arsenal won the fairs cup and cup winners cup

In 70 and 94

Does the Fairs Cup count as a European trophy? I know that it ended up turning into the UEFA Cup, but I think at the point when Arsenal won it it was a competition you took part in by invite and when Arsenal were invited there were clubs who finished higher than them in the League who had not qualified for European competition.
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Re: The Big 6

Postby bubbles1966 on Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:01 pm

The big 6....great band....." I really love your Tiger Feet... "
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Re: The Big 6

Postby hammer1975 on Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:44 pm

Am I the only one who'd happily see the super league that gets threatened from time-to-time happen and then it six leave the prem? Appreciate it would significantly dilute premiership income etc, etc but I just wander if the upsides would outweigh it....
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