One last summer

Does exactly what it says on the tin - the forum for football-related discussion.

Moderators: bristolhammerfc, sicknote, -DL-, Rio, Gnome, chalks, the pink palermo

Re: One last summer

Postby westham,eggyandchips on Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:22 am

ironilunga wrote: Likes of Arne and Lanzini will not stick around if they do not see the club progressing.and adding quality.

Lets see.


Like Mr Payet did?
User avatar
westham,eggyandchips
 
Posts: 13414
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2007 8:06 pm
Location: Taking a walk with Anita Fifa...

Re: One last summer

Postby ironilunga on Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:48 am

DaveWHU1964 wrote:we have now had five consecutive poor (I’m being generous) to absolutely awful windows. Five. And we’re supposed to give them a sixth chance?



I really struggle to see the past 5 windows as awful/poor. The joint favorites for HOTY, for example, come from last summers business and we have over the past few windows signed some really exciting players, particularly offensively. However, I now feel we face a watershed moment; either buy some very decent players to compliment what we already have or watch as the fat cats swoop for our big players Southampton style.

Some will argue that we should have done this when Payet was here and that is fair enough. For me however, I think we are stronger now and with a manager who knows how to handle the big names.

.....................................Adrian.......................................

.?..............Ogbonna....................Reid.................,.......?


........................................?.................................................


............................ ........Mario/?..................................................

................Antonio................................Arnautovic......................

.....................................Lanzini...................................................

...................................Hernandez/?.......................................................


We have really good squad players in the likes of Cresswell, Zabaleta, Noble, Kouyate, Obiang, Collins, Hugill, Masuaku, Obiang and Fonte. However, we need two quality midfielders, some fullbacks and in all probability a top striker.

I am aware that fans hold the board in contempt for all manner of broken promises. However, I started this thread with a focus on playing staff and assurances from the board that quality would improve to the next level following the move of stadiums. Many fans feel that on this particular issue the board have already broken this promise whereas I have chosen to wait a little longer. This Summer will mark two seasons in the new stadium. Time enough IMO for them to keep this promise/or not.

The next level for me is for WHU not to be Southampton and get pillaged by the big boys so easily. As Liverpool know every player has their price but I want players like Arne and Lanzini to stick around long enough for us to build a team good enough to get close to the top 6. I understand that many fans have already seen enough but in respect of playing staff I will personally wait and see what happens this Summer.
User avatar
ironilunga
 
Posts: 3833
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:05 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby hammerman11 on Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:56 am

Time is now they have had long enough. we have needed a def midfielder for ages and we get the mess that was carvalho last summer followed by dedonker crap in January. 4m bid on a player valued at 20m. surely its 15m bid and he would be ours.
RB needed as zab getting on and byram is not good enough
striker needed as we have hernandez and hughill only. Cant count carroll, we need to sell him for 10m and move on.
CB needed as we have too many old ones in fonte and collins . a younger CB to add to reid ogbonna and rice

a new reserve GK is also needed as hart is not good enough to be our number 2. shame but facts.

not far away from a good team/squad. if only they would go for it we could be successful .

they wont so its got to be BOARD OUT
hammerman11
 
Posts: 2869
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:01 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby DaveWHU1964 on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:05 am

II - having previously strongly defended the last summer window, and iirc, starting a thread on the previous one being better than many thought, you started this thread by saying you’d expected a “stronger” summer window - that’s the closest I’ve seen you come to criticism of it.

You yourself are saying you yourself will join the disenchanted if we don’t make a “statement of intent” this summer. If the last few windows had been anything other than poor we would not have to be making such a statement - we’d be putting the icing on an already decent cake. As it is we’re srill trying to borrow some flour and eggs

Anyway, why would you join ranks with the likes of me if broadly speaking you think they’ve done well, or at least OK?
User avatar
DaveWHU1964
 
Posts: 10918
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:14 am

Re: One last summer

Postby hadleighhammer on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:14 am

DaveWHU1964 wrote:II - having previously strongly defended the last summer window, and iirc, starting a thread on the previous one being better than many thought, you started this thread by saying you’d expected a “stronger” summer window - that’s the closest I’ve seen you come to criticism of it.

You yourself are saying you yourself will join the disenchanted if we don’t make a “statement of intent” this summer. If the last few windows had been anything other than poor we would not have to be making such a statement - we’d be putting the icing on an already decent cake. As it is we’re srill trying to borrow some flour and eggs

Anyway, why would you join ranks with the likes of me if broadly speaking you think they’ve done well, or at least OK?


Was also confused myself reading the original post. Why be so disenchanted now if the 2016 window was such fantastic work from our DOF? Or is that spin not working so the next spin is to delay any protest under the banner of "one last chance"?
User avatar
hadleighhammer
Gentrified
 
Posts: 9658
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 6:18 pm
Location: On my computer trying to keep up with the Sky fixture changes

Re: One last summer

Postby ironilunga on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:29 am

Dave, I felt that last Summers window should have been a statement of intent and I think you might have stated in a previous thread that the capture of Carvalho in addition to the players we did sign would have been such a statement. We didn’t get him so in this respect I was also a little disappointed in the end that a good window didn’t turn into a very good window.

If we had never moved stadium I think few could argue with current state of our squad. However, everyone was promised more upon the move to the O.S. I think a couple of seasons is long enough for our board to start upskillong our squad. I saw some positive signs last summer with the capture of Hernandez, Arne, Hart and Zab. However, if the board fail this summer to significantly add further to our first team then I don’t think they ever will. I think that will be it for me in terms of hope of something better.
User avatar
ironilunga
 
Posts: 3833
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:05 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby Rocket on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:30 am

ironilunga wrote:We have really good squad players in the likes of Cresswell, Zabaleta, Noble, Kouyate, Obiang, Collins, Hugill, Masuaku, Obiang and Fonte. However, we need two quality midfielders, some fullbacks and in all probability a top striker.

You what now?
User avatar
Rocket
 
Posts: 3973
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 9:53 am
Location: South-East London

Re: One last summer

Postby ironilunga on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:51 am

Rocket wrote:You what now?


I love that this is the thing that you chose to pull me up on in this thread. Didn't really matter what it was did it :thup:
User avatar
ironilunga
 
Posts: 3833
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:05 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby hadleighhammer on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:51 am

ironilunga wrote:............................ ........Mario/?..................................................


You're basing your 2018 first 11 using a player we have on a Sully special loan with no purchase clause as our only suitable first team quality central midfielder? And you still want to tell everyone we have a good squad and our DOF invested well up until now?!?

That in itself is a massive clue how we have spent cheaply and when we have spent it has been spent poorly by our DOF.
User avatar
hadleighhammer
Gentrified
 
Posts: 9658
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 6:18 pm
Location: On my computer trying to keep up with the Sky fixture changes

Re: One last summer

Postby Danny's Dyer Acting on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:58 am

DaveWHU1964 wrote:I really struggle to see the past 5 windows as awful/poor......


Mario, Arnie, Hernandez, Zabaleta, Masuaku, Hugill, Fonte

The only players you've listed in that post that came in during the last 5 windows. I would say it's only Arnie and Zabs that have been a success at this point (Hernandez will be if he keeps up this form until the end of the season).

On the other hand....Hart, Fernandes, Snodgrass, Ayew, Feghouli, Tore, Zaza, Calleri, Nordveit, Fonte, Arbeloa, Emenike...
User avatar
Danny's Dyer Acting
 
Posts: 913
Joined: Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:37 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby ironilunga on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:00 am

Edited by a moderator
User avatar
ironilunga
 
Posts: 3833
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:05 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby Crouchend_Hammer on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:03 am

ironilunga wrote:
The next level for me is for WHU not to be Southampton and get pillaged by the big boys so easily. As Liverpool know every player has their price but I want players like Arne and Lanzini to stick around long enough for us to build a team good enough to get close to the top 6. I understand that many fans have already seen enough but in respect of playing staff I will personally wait and see what happens this Summer.


Personally I think it is impossible for a club our size to hang on to any 'decent' players. Southampton were hanging around the top 6, and still had to sell anyone half decent. Similarly when Everton were the 'next best' team they had to sell. Leicester won the league and Kante wanted to leave to a club that came 10th because he knew that was a better longer term bet for success

When a bigger club comes calling there is not a lot you can do, as the players themselves want to go.

It is why Sullivan's [promises/ lies/ naive stupidity] delete as applicable, were never going to come to fruition. Without £100s of millions of pounds it is impossible to break into that top echelon on regular basis

A player is not going to stay at a club who comes 7th a couple of seasons running if a top 4 club comes in for them. Their careers are short and they are impatient. Even if a club who came 7th spent £200m, why stay on the chance that may push the team onto 4th, when they can get a transfer to a team who will almost certainly come 4th

Even if we had managed to sneak 4th in 2016, we would probably still be back in the pack now, just as Leicester are
Crouchend_Hammer
 
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 10:31 am
Location: Forest Gate

Re: One last summer

Postby woodford on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:07 am

ironilunga wrote:Dave, I felt that last Summers window should have been a statement of intent and I think you might have stated in a previous thread that the capture of Carvalho in addition to the players we did sign would have been such a statement. We didn’t get him so in this respect I was also a little disappointed i



No disrespect but you cant brush aside the fiasco with Carvalho with a simple "we didn't get him" . Loads of clubs don't get targets. Surely you would concede that the manner in which we didn't get him was an embarrassment to the club and has contributed to the feeling that Sullivan wasn't serious about getting him anyway. Does anyone seriously believe he was making a real effort at signing this bloke??

To follow that up with a £4m offer on a £20m player in the January window should tell you all you need to know. Getting a DM wasn't a Joe Hart type vanity project for the Glorious Leader. That decision to bluff and bull**** could yet cost us a place in the Premier League.

To me he is one of 3 things: incompetent - plain stupid - an asset stripper who's been rumbled

Could be two of those.

However its spun, that man does NOT have the best interests of the club at heart and he is NOT someone that should be running a football club in the year 2018

the One last summer could be our nail in the coffin, do bare that in mind, If Sullivan was genuine ( yeah i know ) he'd hit the ground running in June and we'd do our business early. But make no mistake the excuses will come thick and fast , the best of which will be the World cup.
User avatar
woodford
 
Posts: 4693
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2003 8:35 am
Location: proper biscuits like custard creams or ginger nuts

Re: One last summer

Postby DaveWHU1964 on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:08 am

ironilunga wrote:Dave, I felt that last Summers window should have been a statement of intent and I think you might have stated in a previous thread that the capture of Carvalho in addition to the players we did sign would have been such a statement. We didn’t get him so in this respect I was also a little disappointed in the end that a good window didn’t turn into a very good window.

When we’d signed Hart, Zab, Arnie and Chicarito and appeared on the verge of signing Cavalho and were yet unaware that we’d severely diminish the squad in the meantime I did say it was shaping up to be a
good window. Then the truth came out - Sporting Lisbon called out our owners for what they are and the promised “serious libel”’case appears as far aaay as ever. The squad unarguably diminished between that optimistic post of mine and the end of the window.

Having apparently forgotten that Cavalho ever existed our owners then repeated the exact same trick, and that’s the best word for it, regarding Dendoncker.

II - if your house is worth £500k and I offer you £300k, half now the rest in two instalments next year and the one the year after then technically I’ve made you an offer and can brag to my mates down the pub about the house I’m in for. But in reality I haven’t made an offer. Can we agree on that mate?

You and me have argued the toss about this for a while now but wasn’t it you and me who had a chat a couple of windows ago where we left it with kind of agreeing with the gist that if the next couple of windows weren’t good ones then the game was up. Pretty sure last January was the last of those windows.
User avatar
DaveWHU1964
 
Posts: 10918
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:14 am

Re: One last summer

Postby hadleighhammer on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:10 am

ironilunga wrote:I see you have lurched into paranoia again at the expense of a decent debate.


Hardly a decent debate with you. Previously when debating the owners your response has been "it's fine they charged 7% interest as they reduced it now to 4%" and it was also fine they tried to renege on the STH discount as "they didn't go ahead with it in the end so listened to supporters".

You consistently spin things to deflect from the owners. Now you're trying to deflect any criticism until end of August 2018 (obviously conveniently past March 10th aswell...). Even then I'm sure whatever our DOF does in the 2018 window you will spin it that it was great, just like 2016 which was clearly a disaster for any neutral observer.
User avatar
hadleighhammer
Gentrified
 
Posts: 9658
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 6:18 pm
Location: On my computer trying to keep up with the Sky fixture changes

Re: One last summer

Postby ironilunga on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:15 am

Edited by a moderator
User avatar
ironilunga
 
Posts: 3833
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:05 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby bristolhammerfc on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:21 am

Everyone has a right to debate and reply and you may have opened this debate but it doesn't mean you have the right to moderate on who replies.

Carry on
User avatar
bristolhammerfc
 
Posts: 8211
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: In the city of Brunel, balloons and banksy

Re: One last summer

Postby bristolhammerfc on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:24 am

hadleighhammer wrote:
I prefer pulling up spin and b*llocks when I see it on here.


And i see nothing wrong with doing that. It's for the OP to justify how its not spin, how it's not b*llocks and how the timing of his thread was not contrived.

Carry on
User avatar
bristolhammerfc
 
Posts: 8211
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: In the city of Brunel, balloons and banksy

Re: One last summer

Postby ironilunga on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:28 am

DaveWHU1964 wrote:wasn’t it you and me who had a chat a couple of windows ago where we left it with kind of agreeing with the gist that if the next couple of windows weren’t good ones then the game was up. Pretty sure last January was the last of those windows.


Yes Dave that was me and I think this Summer probably is one more than we originally talked about. Like I say, I think Summer 17 whilst not fantastic was for me a small step in the right direction. It has for me at least kept a little hope burning that we might this summer have the window that the club needs to deliver. That said, I totally understand if others dislike this view or are angered by it. Just my opinion.
User avatar
ironilunga
 
Posts: 3833
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:05 pm

Re: One last summer

Postby bristolhammerfc on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:32 am

Illunga,

I have a serious question.

have you ever been to a game at the OS (London Stadium) and when did you last go to the Boleyn. I think it's relevant to someone asking those who have lived the pain of the move and the promises made to understand how it has affected you?
User avatar
bristolhammerfc
 
Posts: 8211
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:50 pm
Location: In the city of Brunel, balloons and banksy

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bilic'sLimp, Cambiasso, DaveWHU1964, fleetyfoot, Hammers Dad, jastons, JohnSyros, Phil S, Rocketron, thamesideiron and 52 guests