The Ashes 2017/18

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Bend it like Repka
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Bend it like Repka »

That sounds simple doesn't it. Because 90 mph bowlers grow on trees.

From what I've heard on TMS, oz have these 3 and not a lot more in reserve.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Tenbury »

Clearly it was a mistake to leave out Plunkett and Rashid

I,ll don the tinhat again, but I honestly believe everybody's ignoring the elephant in the room: Joe Root, world class batsman, too inexperienced to be captain,especially on an ashes tour in Aus.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by jacko »

Bend it like Repka wrote:That sounds simple doesn't it. Because 90 mph bowlers grow on trees.

From what I've heard on TMS, oz have these 3 and not a lot more in reserve.
All throughout my life I remember us having at least one fast bowler on the fringe of the team. I don't think we've had hardly any for a while. Who was the last decent one...harmison?

Apparently Wood hasn't bowled at 90mph for a while due to injuries.

I know if the bowlers aren't there then it's tough but surely we need to look at a way of nuturing the players coming through. We have been struggling out there for years - we haven't learnt the lessons from the last tour - that's what's so frustrating.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Bend it like Repka »

jacko wrote: I know if the bowlers aren't there then it's tough but surely we need to look at a way of nuturing the players coming through. We have been struggling out there for years - we haven't learnt the lessons from the last tour - that's what's so frustrating.
But i heard this all discussed on the radio the other day.

Firstly really fast bowlers are more injury prone, so more risk for any player in their career and county to invest in

Secondly, in this country, they just aren't needed at county level. Why try to bowl at 90 when you can swing and seam at 83?

You can't even just say prepare flat pitches so we breed bowlers who need to bowl faster. It would probably not benefit batsmen who become flat track bullies and we have plenty of cloud in this country, far more than down under, so the ball will always swing more.

Spinners maybe you can fix, but the conditions are not right to create an army of express pace bowlers.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Tenbury »

I hear (and respect) your view,but weren't Harmy, Gladstone, that turd on Talkbollox, John Snow, Peter Lever Ken Higgs playing in the same climatic conditions?

On another note,I'm not sure the Loughborough thing is working that well.To justify it's expense nobody even looks elsewhere.If you've not been there since conception you don't get a look in however well you play........see Rory Burns for instance,great opener,good captain, never had a sniff.Could have been a great stopgap while Loughborough's wunderkind developed......and Westley?....there must be others.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by smuts »

One wicket required.

Going from about 370/4 in our first innings to an innings defeat takes some doing but we managed it!
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Bend it like Repka »

Tenbury wrote:I hear (and respect) your view,but weren't Harmy, Gladstone, that turd on Talkbollox, John Snow, Peter Lever Ken Higgs playing in the same climatic conditions?
The fact that you have Snow on your list who finished in 1976 says it all. One a decade maybe....
Tenbury wrote:..there must be others.
Quite clearly there aren't yet. The Lions are hardly tearing the world apart.

Jennings and Ballance were "in form" at county level.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Bend it like Repka »

smuts wrote:One wicket required.

Going from about 370/4 in our first innings to an innings defeat takes some doing but we managed it!
Once again though we've lost by a Steve Smith innings. As much as we are wailing, and yes some players are not doing well, take away Smith and put an average batsman in the Aus side and this series would be very different.

Oh, and add Stokes as well. Very different.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by JohnnyMoncs »

I just read a stat that said England have lost by an innings after posting 400+ first up, 3 times in the last 12 and a bit months, before that we'd only managed it twice in history.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Tenbury »

[quote="Bend it like Repka]

Jennings and Ballance were "in form" at county level.[/quote]


TBF, Stone man was picked on his county form,but I take your point.I don't think it's just a complete lack of talent, there's a selection problem too.Strauss needs to take a long look at himself too.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by jacko »

We have always had a fast bowler in or around the test squad but in the last few years things have dried up. Somehow they need to try to develop them. Test cricketers don't actually play a lot of county cricket anyway. When we do get fast bowlers come through they do seem to just fall away.

If the aussies only have 3 fast bowlers then at least they are doing something right by keeping them in the team.

The fact is that genuine pace takes wickets on every surface. We really need to start planning for the next ashes series away becuase if we just take a bunch of medium pacers we are going to get beat again.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by jacko »

Bend it like Repka wrote:
Once again though we've lost by a Steve Smith innings. As much as we are wailing, and yes some players are not doing well, take away Smith and put an average batsman in the Aus side and this series would be very different.

Oh, and add Stokes as well. Very different.
Smith loves batting on these surfaces against these bowlers. True, he's the best player in the world but he would have found it tougher batting against his own attack. We have struggled to get 20 wickets in the matches. We haven't been able to turn the screw when we have been on top. We have have let them off the hook. They are not an exceptional side but they are a little better than us in some key areas and that has made the difference.

I don't think I even disagree with you. But I do think you have to plan for the future so that next time we go to australia we have a more balanced attack.
Last edited by jacko on Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by LincolnshireHammer »

Writing's on the wall for a series whitewash I'm afraid.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by chigwells finest »

clearly the loss of stokes has seriously blunted our attack and his natural aggression has been missed too, always thought it was a tour too far for cook, broad, etc not sure who else would've come in and done better either , the fragility of the batting line up has been there for all to see for the past 2 years .

no surprises when its 5-0
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by smuts »

Broad sadly has been on the decline for a while now. Never been the same with the bat since getting hit in the grille and his wonder spells like Australia at Trent Bridge look a thing of the past. A shame, but perhaps it's time to let him have a breather and see how he is in the summer.

As for Cook, his double ton in the summer shows he still has it in him, but he's a shadow of the player he was when he wracked up the runs 2 tours ago in Australia. Sadly the coaches worked him out after that when they realised that he made nearly all his runs with deliveries short of a length and where he could cut or work it off his hips. Since then everything is full and on off stump and 90% of the time he's struggling. Bloke has been a legend though but it's not often now players quit as skipper and carry on.

So disappointed with Ali. Hardly any runs made and has taken what 3 wickets? If his finger is still rough, he shouldn't be playing.

Malan, Overton and Stoneman deserve a lot of credit though and Vince to be fair looked really good in his last innings up until Starc managed to fluke one off a crack yesterday. :wink:

With a spinner not turning it half inch and 4 seamers all around 78-84 mph, it's no wonder we've been outgunned. Smith makes a massive difference to their side, but it doesn't excuse us not being able to take the wickets of the other players in the side who have all hung around and chipped in while he's at the non striker's end.

The 3 Australian quicks and Lyon have been top notch sadly. 8 consecutive defeats now, hopefully we can at least stop that record in the next 2 tests now the pressure's off and the Ashes are gone.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by chigwells finest »

on the last tour we took 4 quicks inc boyd rankin who was supposed to get more bounce out of the aussie pitches along with finn etc , have we not managed in 4 years to find another quick bowler who can bowl more than 4 overs in a spell ( mills ) without falling apart ? he ( rankin ) quickly disappeared into the abyss , Finn has never regained his rhythm .

im not surprised that we've lost , as most test series these days the home side tends to dominate , but Root seems to think we have competed ? i must have missed that
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Slacking student »

We've had moments, fleeting moments but moments that if we had played well for a session we'd have won all three test matches.

However we've lost everyone of these crucial moments.

240/4 at the Gabba became 302 all out in the first innings, then we had them 76/4 and 209/7 in reply

Had them 209/5 in Adelaide which is before we mention how they wasted the new ball in favourable conditions

368/4 here and collapsed to 403 all out. They're have been chances in every game, slim ones in some cases, we've just managed to fluff the lines each time.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by sosc67 »

Thank you for sending Broad and Anderson out as our P.R. team. :thup:
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by Hawaiian hammer »

Some good news. Starc is out injured and Smith is also injured but no decision if he will play or not yet.
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Re: The Ashes 2017/18

Post by smuts »

What was Anderson going on about? Beyond their 3 first choice fast bowlers, the Aussies pace attack has problems....where does that leave ours then?
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