West Ham accounts reveal loss of £37m

[Major]

37Mill???

Duckers must have employed my c*** of an ex missus. She really is good a bleeding things dry.

I now there are a lot of i told you so's on here but has anyone gone back far enough to when Brown went and a few of us were saying, be careful what you wish for!!!!

It was worth it to get rid of that c*** Brown.

A **** undoubtedley

But less of a **** than the bald fella IMO...

[old fart]

This is the crux of the biscuit for me - BG bought the club when it was at a premium and now we're saddled with debts that reflect that, .

But the accounts clearly show, we're not saddled with any debts beyond our bank borrowings, sheffield united etc etc, all now have ordered repayment plans over the next five years arranged, the wages are back in control, there will be a profit, which together with future player sales *should give us a pot to piss in regards the transfer market next summer

so only one more whining january window to survive, hurrah, not that I think we did that badly considiering we were skint

Any old debts Hansa BG etc etc owe are nothing to do with the football club, they can only be amortised out of any sale price if & when C&B decide someones offers the right money for them and there is no path for C&B to asset strip the club. It is therefore in C&B s interest once Straumur have sorted out their moratoriun & re-structuring to offer limited support in order to nurture their investment


* unless some other crisis of our own making currently not even been dreamed abou yet hits us

[QuintonNimoy]

I was labouring under the impression that some of BG's personally secured debt had made it's way through to us, or was residing in Straumur/CB and holding up the sale somehow. Then again, I didn't get much sleep last night - maybe I'll leave difficult subjects alone for today!

[joyful]

* unless some other crisis of our own making currently not even been dreamed abou yet hits us

From the official site:
Ferrari was signed before the transfer deadline but his arrival could only be announced once international clearance was received. The club are grateful to the FA and Premier League for their help.

I'm just having a jittery wednesday -- they couldn't, could they?

[old fart]

From the official site:
Ferrari was signed before the transfer deadline but his arrival could only be announced once international clearance was received. The club are grateful to the FA and Premier League for their help.

I'm just having a jittery wednesday -- they couldn't, could they?

we have no paperwork that the premier league need to see

[hammer]

A c*** undoubtedley

But less of a c*** than the bald fella IMO...

[Kent Bubble Blower]

It was worth it to get rid of that c*** Brown.

A c*** undoubtedley

But less of a c*** than the bald fella IMO...

The whole debacle with the Icelandics certainly seems to have been a perfect example of "better the devil you know!"

[SBB]

...
The simple fact is NO ONE WANTS TO BUY WEST HAM ... Maybe there are vultures waiting to swoop once Straumur goes belly up ... but if the club was worth the kind of money that people pretend it is, someone would have bought it. And they haven't, any more than they've bought Newcastle, Everton, Liverpool, Birmingham (unless Carson Yeung suddenly puts more money where his mouth has long been) or any of the other clubs currently up for grabs.

All in all, anyone putting in a net £50m, over and above West Ham's debts would be taking a significant risk. They might be getting a big club for a knockdown price. Or they might just be chucking more good money after all the bad that's already been thrown away.

As you say, an asset is worth what someone is prepared to pay for it. For the past 12 months, the club has effectively been open to offers. None have been made. Ergo, it's worth f*ck-all. I stand by my argument until a buyer proves me wrong.

But no one has yet ...

I absolutely agree.......Fair point, made well.

Your first post was still a load of old tosh though

[Apples an Pairs]

* unless some other crisis of our own making currently not even been dreamed abou yet hits us

Like this years plummetting gate / TV revenues

[QuintonNimoy]

Like this years plummetting gate / TV revenues

You'll have to elaborate on the TV revenues bit. Our single home game in the PL so far was attended reasonably well, how would you quanitify plummetting?

[Major]

You'll have to elaborate on the TV revenues bit. Our single home game in the PL so far was attended reasonably well, how would you quanitify plummetting?

F = G mM/r2

Its true ask Newton

[old fart]

I thought we had to go up first

[Cuenca 'ammer]

CB and QN you both make valid points.

However, rather than try to pick up the club at a knock down price, any seriously interested buyer should look to find a decent medium ground whereby they could buy the club and all of it's debts at a fair price and hopefully Straumer/CB would agree to sell. The turn around in the economy will come, sooner or later, and then the knockdown prices won't be available and maybe owners will have to pay inflated prices. Of course this all hinges on the end of or rather deadline of the moratorium. (If that's the correct word or even spelling).

A serious potential owner should make a fair offer that is close to the evaluation taking the debt and future payouts together. Looking for a cheap bargain in my mind sends the wrong signal to fans (and current owners) in that someone is looking to buy something on the cheap and that doesn't exactly fill me with a nice warm glow.

Notice on the gates at U.P. "Serious offers only. No cheap skate bids accepted."

[old fart]

The turn around in the economy will come, sooner or later, and then the knockdown prices won't be available and maybe owners will have to pay inflated prices.

lets hope Straumur & CB holdings haven't thought of that

[QuintonNimoy]

Its true ask Newton

He went to the toilet about 30 minutes ago and won't come out. What's he doing in there?

[Cuenca 'ammer]

OF

It seems like a bit of a game of Russian roulette here. Don't Straumer face another moratorium (or whatever it's called) in December ??

I must admit that now the waters are murkier than ever with the release of the new old accounts and no one knows what the new new accounts look like. If anyone waits until the next deadline and the sale of the club is stressed by the creditors there will be o time to get the take over sorted before the NEXT window closes. It may put us back in getting someone new in, or with the uncertainty, both Green AND Upson look to move on. There will be injuries, loss of form to players with some of the bigger clubs or maybe even a dark horse pushing for a Euro place be it the Chumps or the new Euro league. We may not be looking much of a prospect to a potential newcomers and may look more enticing to the better players on the team. Of course entirely the reverse may apply and we may look a great prospect.

However, while it is a management company owning us, who really have no long term goals (other than being self sufficient and that's not a problem) it does make a HUGE difference to players who are already here or may think that we have no light at the end of the tunnel (other than it being another Express train).

Anyone remember the list that Eggy showed Lucas Neill ?? I bet it didn't have Ilunga or Da Costa, or even Savio on it.

:cry:

[old fart]

OF

It seems like a bit of a game of Russian roulette here. Don't Straumer face another moratorium (or whatever it's called) in December ??

I must admit that now the waters are murkier than ever with the release of the new old accounts and no one knows what the new new accounts look like. If anyone waits until the next deadline and the sale of the club is stressed by the creditors there will be o time to get the take over sorted before the NEXT window closes. It may put us back in getting someone new in, or with the uncertainty, both Green AND Upson look to move on. There will be injuries, loss of form to players with some of the bigger clubs or maybe even a dark horse pushing for a Euro place be it the Chumps or the new Euro league. We may not be looking much of a prospect to a potential newcomers and may look more enticing to the better players on the team. Of course entirely the reverse may apply and we may look a great prospect.

However, while it is a management company owning us, who really have no long term goals (other than being self sufficient and that's not a problem) it does make a HUGE difference to players who are already here or may think that we have no light at the end of the tunnel (other than it being another Express train).

Anyone remember the list that Eggy showed Lucas Neill ?? I bet it didn't have Ilunga or Da Costa, or even Savio on it.

:cry:

The way i see it is, that as CB holdings don't have to put any money into us, the current management team are protecting their investment quite well ( that doesn't necessarily mean to the fans satifsaction). Duckers is enjoying playing big chief, Nani and Zola are enjoying the fruits of the academy to hone their coaching skills,

CB sit back wait until the market improves, if the Straumur re structuring goes through (which it will) there's no pressure to sell until a good offer comes in

So forget about who owns us for the time being and good degree patience is required to see whether Duckers & Zola et al are as good as they say and think they are, to satisfy the punters (us),


it will all go wrong but thats always been the fun hasn't it , it makes the highs so enjoyable

[Cuenca 'ammer]

Is there a guarantee that the restructuring will go through though ?? It only takes one twitchy (not meaning old saggy chops) creditor if we see a dip in the slow recovery and someone might think 50 cents now is better than maybe 65 cents in 2 years. The economy isn't going to turn around that soon imho, for a dozen or so potential buyers to suddenly spring up and spunk out 150 mill or so for a mid size mid table outfit like us. We have no increase in potential due to the lack of ground development so that in the event that we were to challenge for a top four finish we couldn't bring in the kin dof gate receipts that someone twice our size could. I know the t.v. revenue would be fantastic BUT, we would still not be able to extract maximum revenue streams that large gates would bring.

Therefore there is only a certain limited area of investors that we could expect. No self respecting arab or far easterner (no disrespect intended) would see us as a decent investment at all.Self sustaining or otherwise.

[cockney hammer]

http://www.ilfordrecorder.co.uk/content ... 3A46%3A760" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
£100m - Hammers count the cost of Eggy’s big splurge



BAD NEWS seems to be so synonymous with West Ham at the moment that you may have thought that Britain's current fall guy - prime minister Gordon Brown - had come out in support of the club, writes DAVE EVANS.

Calum Davenport, Jack Collison's sad loss and the ugly scenes at Upton Park for the Carling Cup clash with Millwall have put West Ham on to the news pages of the tabloids as well as the sports pages.

And so it is no surprise that the club seemed to have stumbled into another crisis with the news that they lost a staggering £37.4m in the year ending 2008.

These accounts, published over a year late by West Ham, paint a grim picture of the financial state of the club, with finance director Nick Igoe describing the business strategy during the period leading up to May 2008 as "fundamentally flawed".

The situation is made worse by the fact that the collapse of shirt sponsor XL, which cost the club around £4m, and the out-of-court settlement with Sheffield United over the Carlos Tevez affair, which set West Ham back another £26m over five years, are not included on this set of accounts.

Debt may be the word of the moment, but West Ham seem to have more than their fair share.

In the previous accounts, the debts were stated as £54m, but it seems that one year of decadence under former chairman Eggert Magnusson has plunged that nearer to £100m.

Igoe also revealed that West Ham broke banking rules over the repayment of their debt, and only the goodwill of the banks prevented them from more serious trouble.

"The scale of operating losses and wages caused the group to breach certain banking coven-ants in 2007-08," Igoe explained in the report.

"Although the group's banking syndicate waived these breaches, a business strategy which relies on the goodwill of the group's bankers to waive covenant breaches is fundamentally flawed."

It is unclear how common this sort of practise by the banks is when dealing with debt-ridden football clubs. West Ham's deficit of around £100m is chicken feed compared to some Premier League teams.

As of May 2008, Arsenal owed £416m, Fulham £197m, Manchester United £699m, Manchester City £147m and Liverpool around £300m.

All of those clubs, bar Fulham, have turnovers far in excess of that of West Ham as well as billionaire owners to make such debts managable.

When you look at some of the profligacy involved at West Ham during this period, it is clear to see that much of the fault lies with former owner Bjorgolfur Gudmundsson. He put Magnusson into the hot seat and allowed his fellow Icelander to go on a massive spending spree both in terms of transfers and wages.

Allegedly, Magnusson and chief executive Scott Duxbury would check with Gudmundsson as to whether they could afford to continue spending and the owner gave them the all clear, suggesting he was funding it with his own money, when in reality he was doing it via bank loans.

It is a small leap from that to work out how the current economic crisis in Iceland originated.

"It is clear with the benefit of hindsight that not all of the investment undertaken in the playing squad in the period under review was prudent," Igoe continued. "West Ham purchased three high-profile players in 2007-08 at a combined cost of £20m with total annual wages in excess of £12m. Those players made 36 starting appearances between them in the season."

The last part of that statement seems to be something of a red herring.

The players concerned were Freddie Ljungberg, Craig Bellamy and Kieron Dyer, and the fact that two of them were injured for most of that season is certainly not West Ham's fault - paying the transfer fees and the wages in the first place certainly is.

West Ham's increased salaries for players took their wage bill

to turnover rating to 78 per

cent, but when you compare it to other Premier League clubs, it is a figure that is not alarming, despite Igoe stating that it was "unsustainable".

In the same year, West Brom, managed 80 per cent, Wigan 89 per cent with Stoke City at a staggering 106 per cent so West Ham's figure does not seem so out of the ordinary.

Yet it is obvious that West Ham over-reached themselves in the days of Magnusson, and they are still paying for those mistakes today.

The sales of Bellamy, Anton Ferdinand, George McCartney, Bobby Zamora, Hayden Mullins, Matty Etherington, James Collins and Savio have helped to recoup some money and slash the wage bill, but at what cost to the first team?

And things are likely to get worse before they get better.

The accounts for the period up to May 2009 are already overdue, and West Ham fans must hope that there are

no more skeletons in the cupboard waiting to leap

out.

[AlfieG]

Yep, It was all eggys fault.......

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.