Allardyce: Stick or twist?

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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby wizzo_66 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:28 pm

The Song/Noble/Kouyate midfield that ripped Liverpool apart?

Some have short memories.

We wouldn't have even been discussing it if we'd converted the chances we created. Poor finishing on at least 4 occasions.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby e17 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:29 pm

Romford wrote:Sam should have started with the team that created havoc v City.

Irony = Allardyce was rinsed all of last season by some on here for NEVER shaking stuff up or varying his players or tactics against different teams. Exciting he is this term & has the manpower to do so, no?

Villa were clearly desperate for anything yesterday after their recent free-fall.. On most days so far this season, at the very least Downing would have netted in the first half & Sakho in the second... Almost any attacking player on the pitch would have netted Jenkinson's too

Any of that lot, we wouldn't really be having this debate mate. You know I'm right :wink:
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby e17 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:31 pm

wizzo_66 wrote:We wouldn't have even been discussing it if we'd converted the chances we created. Poor finishing on at least 4 occasions.

That is the long & short of it

It's also why Nolan is eternally crucial to the cause.. in those scenarios yesterday he'd have probably scored at least two.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby sendô on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:34 pm

wizzo_66 wrote:The Song/Noble/Kouyate midfield that ripped Liverpool apart?

Some have short memories.


Firstly, that was a completely different game. Those three worked in that game because they bossed an attack minded Liverpool team that would look to play through the middle, therefore these three could break up play. This tactic would never work against a Villa side with almost no intention of attacking.

Second, those three did not "rip Liverpool apart" - our attacking three of Downing, Sakho and Valencia did that. These three merely created the platform to launch the attacks from.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby wizzo_66 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:43 pm

Noble picked Liverpool off all game. Not as fashionable as a striker so he won't get the credit.

Kouyate had a stinker yesterday, he played the game of his life against Liverpool.

I'll repeat the chances bit again. As no one would be discussing this if we'd tucked away the big chances. That's where we failed to win the game, not in the middle of the park.

We won't out play every team in every area in every game. Small margins at this level. The midfield 3 may not have had their best game, but they arguably did enough to play their part in a 3 or 4-0 victory. Poor finishing cost us that.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby New Jersey on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:56 pm

Whoever mentioned the Arsenal expectation comment has it right. Yes, we all think we should have beaten Villa, a team that had lost six in a row. Yes the amount of chances we created, whether they were quality chances or not should have seen us get the three points. Yes we are a much better team than last season, but every game in the Premiership is tough, and we aren't going to win them all.

I guess it's an indication of how far we have improved when people are questioning our tactics, our team selection and the subs made after a game where we thrashed them 0-0. Can't see how Sam got it wrong, another day it would have been 4-0. Sitting 4th in the league, three points behind last year's Champions, above Everton, Liverpool, Spurs and Man Utd, we must be doing something right. Just enjoy it for now.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Romford on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:02 pm

wizzo_66 wrote:The Song/Noble/Kouyate midfield that ripped Liverpool apart?

Some have short memories.

We wouldn't have even been discussing it if we'd converted the chances we created. Poor finishing on at least 4 occasions.


Did Liverpool try and defend deep and hit us on the break ?

I have a very long memory fella.....and I also understand the differences between how teams are going to come and play. Villa were always going to come for a point...you think you set up the same way against them as you do Liverpool ??

Villa's left back was shocking...how we didn't direct everything down that wing was poor.

I can also remember some fantastic performances by keepers over the past 40 years.

One of them was not done yesterday by a Yank...
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Romford on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:07 pm

New Jersey wrote:Whoever mentioned the Arsenal expectation comment has it right. Yes, we all think we should have beaten Villa, a team that had lost six in a row. Yes the amount of chances we created, whether they were quality chances or not should have seen us get the three points. Yes we are a much better team than last season, but every game in the Premiership is tough, and we aren't going to win them all.

I guess it's an indication of how far we have improved when people are questioning our tactics, our team selection and the subs made after a game where we thrashed them 0-0. Can't see how Sam got it wrong, another day it would have been 4-0. Sitting 4th in the league, three points behind last year's Champions, above Everton, Liverpool, Spurs and Man Utd, we must be doing something right. Just enjoy it for now.


Do you think that's how quality teams think ?

In Sams interview he admits he had to change tactics to get Dowling more involved.....

I still say had we got behind their full backs and put quality in we'd have got a lot more joy. The lack of crosses from dangerous areas and the lack of invention from the corners was our shortfall yesterday.

That is 100% tactics...
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Romford on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:11 pm

wizzo_66 wrote:Noble picked Liverpool off all game. Not as fashionable as a striker so he won't get the credit.

Kouyate had a stinker yesterday, he played the game of his life against Liverpool.

I'll repeat the chances bit again. As no one would be discussing this if we'd tucked away the big chances. That's where we failed to win the game, not in the middle of the park.

We won't out play every team in every area in every game. Small margins at this level. The midfield 3 may not have had their best game, but they arguably did enough to play their part in a 3 or 4-0 victory. Poor finishing cost us that.


What big chances ?

The Sakho header or the Jenkinson header......they are the only "good" chances i can remember.

We had 13 corners and only produced 2 half decent efforts out of them !?

We lacked invention...and went back to the direct approach in the end to actually put some much needed pressure that nearly broke them down.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Romford on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:16 pm

e17 wrote:Irony = Allardyce was rinsed all of last season by some on here for NEVER shaking stuff up or varying his players or tactics against different teams. Exciting he is this term & has the manpower to do so, no?

Villa were clearly desperate for anything yesterday after their recent free-fall.. On most days so far this season, at the very least Downing would have netted in the first half & Sakho in the second... Almost any attacking player on the pitch would have netted Jenkinson's too

Any of that lot, we wouldn't really be having this debate mate. You know I'm right :wink:


I still cannot believe you think we played well.......and i couldn't disagree with you more.

We are not the poor team we were last season....we now have a very good squad who should be able to cause teams like Villa more problems than we did yesterday. I believe the midfield had the wrong shape and was too "Samey".

If a keeper has a worldy and we muller the oppo's then i would be first to say "One of those days"

I didn't think that was the story of yesterday.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Grandad Hammer on Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:38 pm

Here we are 4th in the league, in the champions league places and still this bloody debate continues, it is just plain rude! Time for us all to be grateful that we have such a competent manager; were he to leave there would be a queue of club chairmen wanting to employ him.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Whufc06 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:49 pm

Yet not as rude as basically telling people they are not allowed to voice their opinion.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby westham,eggyandchips on Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:50 pm

Romford wrote:
I still cannot believe you think we played well.......and i couldn't disagree with you more.

We are not the poor team we were last season....we now have a very good squad who should be able to cause teams like Villa more problems than we did yesterday. I believe the midfield had the wrong shape and was too "Samey".

If a keeper has a worldy and we muller the oppo's then i would be first to say "One of those days"

I didn't think that was the story of yesterday.

Surely these comments should be in the match thread?

IIRC you didn't say much in this thread after we beat City, Liverpool or Burnley regarding tactics? Just a thought. 8-)
Last edited by westham,eggyandchips on Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby mywhufc on Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:52 pm

Grandad Hammer wrote:Here we are 4th in the league, in the champions league places and still this bloody debate continues, it is just plain rude! Time for us all to be grateful that we have such a competent manager; were he to leave there would be a queue of club chairmen wanting to employ him.

How many of those chairman queuing would be at clubs bigger than WHU.
My guess would be 0
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Rocketron on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:10 pm

Whufc06 wrote:Yet not as rude as basically telling people they are not allowed to voice their opinion.

Why are you still voicing it when it has been proven wrong ?
We are 4th in the League !
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Jigga on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:20 pm

Playing 3 DM from the start cost us the three points. We lacked width and the front two were isolated for most of the game. Disappointed Sam didn't drop Kouyate or Noble.

Was having a debate in the supporters after the gene. Is Kouyate a DM or a box to box midfielder? my mate thinks his a direct replacement for Diame but personally I think his a more holding type player who breaks up play...
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Whufc06 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:33 pm

Rocketron - I'm not voicing an opinion. I'm happy with how things are going. My opinion of last season wasn't there to be proven wrong. Just saying that people are entitled to their opinion still.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Wildy on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:36 pm

Jigga wrote:Playing 3 DM from the start cost us the three points. We lacked width and the front two were isolated for most of the game. Disappointed Sam didn't drop Kouyate or Noble.

Was having a debate in the supporters after the gene. Is Kouyate a DM or a box to box midfielder? my mate thinks his a direct replacement for Diame but personally I think his a more holding type player who breaks up play...


Kouyate cannot be seen as a replacement for Diame, if/when he starts he should be there to break play up. I agree, playing Song, Noble and Kouyate to a team like Villa didn't help us. Lost our shape quite a lot.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Up the Junction on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:45 pm

T-14 days.
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Re: Allardyce: Stick or twist

Postby Romford on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:49 pm

westham,eggyandchips wrote:Surely these comments should be in the match thread?

IIRC you didn't say much in this thread after we beat City, Liverpool or Burnley regarding tactics. Just a thought. 8-)


If you look at the first post this morning you might understand the situation of why it was posted ....it was only 2 in front of the one you have highlighted.
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