Leicester City 1 West Ham United 2 (23/04/12)

[Turns to Stone]

IRickie Lambert cost £1m. Grant Holt cost £400,000. Much better footballers than Cole. Not to mention many different types of forwards that have a different style and game to CC but are better players. You can definitely replace Cole with better without spending an awfully large amount of money, if you have some awareness and scouting ability of what a good player is.

Rickie Lambert (30) never played in the top flight - Grant Holt (31) 1 season in the top flight. Carlton Cole (28) 10 seasons in the Premier League, 7 England Caps.

If they really are 'much better footballers' than Cole. Then what the f*ck is wrong with all the scouting networks of the Premier League?

[Bobby Orangeboom]

Rickie Lambert cost £1m. Grant Holt cost £400,000. Much better footballers than Cole. .

Holt & Lambert were both playing in League 1 at 30 & 29 years old respectively.

If they were both " much better footballers " than Cole, you would have thought they would have been playing at a higher level at those ages wouldn't you ?

[Cuenca 'ammer]

But we ain't playing at a higher level lads.....

And BFS said if we had Lambert we would have walked this league.

Can't have it both ways...

[Sloop John B]

To be fair to Aztec I think there is some decent quality for less than the "premier League Striker" going rate and in this league we could have easily have replaced Cole in Jan with Vaz Te and Jason Roberts and been quite happy i think.

Whether they are better players than Cole are, and whether we'd be happy in a years time with that strike force in the premiership is a bit different.

[Bobby Orangeboom]

But we ain't playing at a higher level lads.....

That's not the point at all, the point is Aztec said they were both much better payers than Cole which isn't true as if they were, they would have been playing at a much higher level than League 1 at 29 & 30 years of age respectively.

Context Mr Ouston, context.

[Turns to Stone]

But we ain't playing at a higher level lads.....

And BFS said if we had Lambert we would have walked this league.

Can't have it both ways...

No, Oust, because it's subjective. If we'd had a 27 year-old Guy Whittingham then we'd have walked this league as well. Rickie Lambert's in a great vein of form. And is a very good football. But I do get annoyed when fans just throwaway remarks about how opposition players are vastly better than ours off the back of a few games they've seen and lower-level stats.

As Bob and I have said, if they really were that good, why have they never gone about their level?

[libero]

I think last night perfectly showed why we'll most probably just miss out on automatic promotion.

Sam knows how to win away. He knows how to defend high, soak up pressure and catch teams on the break. He knows how to do that away from home when the other team is chasing the game

Leicester started at a gallop, looking for attacking options, but that plays into Sam's game plan. Last night it worked perfectly (even though Leicester took the lead) and we looked as if we could waltz it.

But then Sam get's into a panic. Rather than thinking of sorting out the goal difference, thrashing Leicester out of sight, he takes off Cole and brings on Collins, starts defending deep, punting the ball away and Leicester understand the message and almost equalize.

That's why we've let in more late goals than any other team this season and why we've drawn so often at home. We got away with it last night (just) but Sam's negative nervousness at the end after a great first 60 minutes almost cost us what should have been a huge, thumping victory

Let's hope he doesn't panic in the play offs

[Aztec Hammer]

You genuinely believe Carlton Cole is a better player than Rickie Lambert?

Well, I guess it is all opinions. I strongly believe Lambert is a superior player to Cole.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/9725 ... hip/page/7" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - dated 2008, talk of Lambert being Prem class. TTS, I haven't built this opinion of Lambert based on some lower league stats and a few games I have seen him play for So'ton. Personally, I've been a fan of his for a good few years now, going back to his Brissy days. Just because he was playing in League 1 whilst Carlton had an England cap and was scoring a few goals in the league, it does not mean he cannot be a better player now.

Because, as it turns out, at this moment in time, Lambert has more of a chance of being a Premier League striker next year than CC does. And besides, as Cuenca mentioned, we aren't currently a premier league club. Again though, I got jumped on for my belief that Lambert and Holt are better players than Cole is, which I do believe to be the case, but at the end of the day, it's all opinions!

[Yea Why Not]

Aztec,

The thing is, you are basing your opinion on just this season. Like it or not Cole has scored double figures the past 4 seasons. 3 of those seasons he did it playing for a Premiership club. It also wasn't too long a go that Cole was being touted about as a £16 million transfer target for Liverpool

Jason Roberts has been superb since joining Reading. Is he a better player than Cole?

[Doc H Ball]

Go on Doc?

John Percy UtJ

The Independent - 'Just as West Ham's supporters began to show signs of turning against their team, the visitors took the lead'.

The Daily Star (I was bored) - ''West Ham's supporters began to show signs of turning against their team by ordering them to 'play on the floor''.

Don't know if you know Percy, but he sounds like another one that likes bandwagons and misconstrues our support.

Like Aceface I am fairly sick of the stick our support gets. It was top drawer last night - shame no jouno outside of our own mentioned the fact.

[taffhammer]

Rickie Lambert (30) never played in the top flight - Grant Holt (31) 1 season in the top flight. Carlton Cole (28) 10 seasons in the Premier League, 7 England Caps.

If they really are 'much better footballers' than Cole. Then what the f*ck is wrong with all the scouting networks of the Premier League?

Intresting when you think about it,Cole the rare English kid that comes through the youth ranks and makes it at a big club early on is certainly no better than Lambert and Holt this season who have been plying their trade in the lower leagues.
What a shame for a lot of English players who have to play lower down the ladder because the big clubs just go and buy foriegn players when needed instead of giving them or many others a chance.

[Bobby Orangeboom]

You genuinely believe Carlton Cole is a better player than Rickie Lambert?

Well, I guess it is all opinions. I strongly believe Lambert is a superior player to Cole.

If so, why has Lambert spent his entire career playing in divisions 1 & 2, only playing in the championship for the first time in his career this season, and Carlton Cole has played his entire career in the Premiership all bar this year, and has represented England at various levels playing 25 plus times for his Country ?

He's 30 years old remember too Lambert ?

[cockney farmer]

Only West Ham , placing to one side our home record, where else could you see such a level of debate about our quality of strikers, away tactics and general away performances when we have just broken ....no ...smashed a club away win record, championship manager/fifa computer games have a lot to answer for.

[Aztec Hammer]

Aztec,

The thing is, you are basing your opinion on just this season. Like it or not Cole has scored double figures the past 4 seasons. 3 of those seasons he did it playing for a Premiership club. It also wasn't too long a go that Cole was being touted about as a £16 million transfer target for Liverpool

Jason Roberts has been superb since joining Reading. Is he a better player than Cole?

Couple of things YWN,

Firstly, I am not basing my opinion solely on this season. As mentioned in my previous post, I have followed Lambert's career since his early days with Bristol Rovers. I thought he was playing way below his level then. Then this season at Southampton, he has dominated this league and it would seem, driven his team to the PL.

However, this whole debate stemmed from me replying to a comment about replacing Carlton Cole. That would make this a present day situation, so yeah, I am talking about the here and now when I say I believe Lambert is a better footballer than Cole. Granted, we couldn't sign him for £1m now. I am sure he is worth much more than that, but, before Southampton pinched him, I rated him and would have loved it if we would have been the team to pinch him over Southampton. I am not basing that off of what I have seen this year, whether you want to believe it or not, I truly rated him pre-Southampton.

My original point was quite clearly to say that I didn't agree with the comment that we would have to spend 'awfully large amounts' of dough to replace Carlton Cole. There are quality players out there that can be had for relatively small fees.

As for your question, do I believe Jason Roberts is a better player than Cole. I don't, but I don't think the difference between the two is as great as the difference between Lambert and Cole.

[Aztec Hammer]

If so, why has Lambert spent his entire career playing in divisions 1 & 2, only playing in the championship for the first time in his career this season, and Carlton Cole has played his entire career in the Premiership all bar this year, and has represented England at various levels playing 25 plus times for his Country ?

He's 30 years old remember too Lambert ?

I'm going to say that Carlton Cole has played the majority of his career in the Prem because he started out in the Chelsea youth academy. Whilst Lambert started out in the Blackpool youth ranks. That helps.

Players develop at different rates. I don't see the validity in stating that Cole has played the majority of his career in the Prem whilst Lambert has in League 1 and 2 when the main point is about the present. I believe Lambert is a better player than Cole. I'm not just saying this, but if you would have asked me this during our relegation season, I would have said the same thing. I saw Lambert play a fair bit then, regardless of the fact that it was with Southampton in League 1.

I tend to rate players by their own skill, not what league they are in. Of course it is easier to play in League 1 as opposed to the PL. But I still thought Lambert was the more talented player then.

As for the scouting thing, some teams can miss out. Just because he hasn't made it to the top level until seemingly now, it does not mean he hasn't been any good up until now.

[Yea Why Not]

Aztec,

You've obviously seen a lot of the player so im more than happy to respect your opinion. My question would be though, why if you believe he has always played below his level has it taken until the age of 30 before he is given the chance to play in the Championship? That's a serious question. I mean, from what I've seen this season he looks to be an excellent player at this level

I'd personally doubt whether he has enough about him to play Premiership football. Cole has the pace and power to trouble top defenders on his day, Lambert simply hasn't. But then if I'm honest I'd have said the same about Grant Holt and he hasn't done half bad this season

It'll be interesting to see how he does next season if Southampton are promoted. And it'll leave a lot of people in the game scratching their heads if he does do well

It just seems a bit strange to me that if he has been the player you say he has that no Championship manager has ever taken a punt on him

I mean, Cole would attract all sorts of interest from Championship teams if we were to let him go in the summer. Probably even some Premiership clubs....

[Simply Moore]

Don't know about Cole being better than Lambert or Holt better than Cole but I do know that my dad is bigger than your dad!

[Bobby Orangeboom]

I'm not just saying this, but if you would have asked me this during our relegation season, I would have said the same thing. I saw Lambert play a fair bit then, regardless of the fact that it was with Southampton in League 1.

.

No offence, but i don't believe you in the slightest.

[Aztec Hammer]

No offence, but i don't believe you in the slightest.

That's up to you mate. I don't know why you wouldn't take my word for it, it's only watching football. What would be the point in lying about something as trivial as that on a message board?

Anyway, regardless, Lambert/Holt/whoever it is doesn't play for West Ham. Carlton does, so I hope and would love it if he does the business in the Playoffs. On his day, like many say, he can be a complete menace. It's just very rare nowadays that it is his day. Also, he's definitely having some problems with his knees, it's become quite noticeable in the last few games.

[bristolhammerfc]

I have watched Lambert a lot. There is no way he is playing below his level. Quite the opposite.

How many players have had a good championship season to be bought and end up playing in league 2 after a season.