Thanks Sam job well done Sir.

[Morocco Mole]

Clucking Bell.

Sometimes it takes an exile to give a bit of perspective......

[richneal]

Agree that congrats and a big thanks are due to BFS - achieved the job he was hired to, which was no easy task. Regardless of the players we had and their salaries, bringing us up on the first try should be acknowledged as a considerable achievement. It's a tough job - pressure and expectations from punters like us make it incredibly so.

However, I also share the concerns of many posters who aren't sure that Sam's style of play and tactics are fantastic:

1.There's been far too may points this season when watching us has been about as much fun as watching paint dry.

2. Furthermore, IMO, Sam's reluctance to adopt a more attacking style of play may have cost us quite a few points this season. Other posters on this forum described those safety-first tactics as 'cowardly.' Not sure I agree with that word, but I get their point.

3. Lastly, other teams can read us like a book - they know how he'll line 'em up and know what our tactics will be.

[HammerTel]

It`s funny when anyone ever dare`s question Sam Allardyce`s credentials the old chestnuts of Zola and Grant are mentioned,I have no idea why they are the yardstick,how about comparing Allardyce to Pardew?
I tend to look forward not back it cant have escaped many people`s attention that the Premier League is getting more and more technical with younger dynamic coaches/managers moving from the likes of Norwich/Swansea to Villa and Liverpool respectively,with Roberto Martinez looking destined for greener pastures, as well as the incredible job Pardew is doing at Newcastle!
The first 2 thirds of the season was pretty poor interspersed with some good performances,I was very dissapointed we practically binned both the cups at the first hurdle,we have a great cup tradition and if going out tamely to lower league opposition can be easily mitigated as we were "concentrating on promotion" then the same can be said as we look to grind our way to 40 point`s and safety,and to be frank it would be wholly unacceptable.
For those people who do live in the past quoting Zola and Grant,I feel Zola as a rookie boss clearly lacked that little bit of experience when we struggled,which could also have been said at times with Pardew it`s all part of the learning curve,I`m interested to know from the most loyal of Sam Allardyce`s fans how many points is he going to be superior to Zola at the end of the upcoming Premier League campaign?

[bspur1]

3. Lastly, other teams can read us like a book - they know how he'll line 'em up and know what our tactics will be.

Blacpool 10-1 on aggregate
Brighton 6-0
Nottingham 4-0
Watt ford 4-0

yep ,read us like a book

I can tell you how andwhat Man Cities, Arsenals and Man United line ups and tactics will be next year, it will be free flowing passing football looking to create space and opportunities for their forwards , Rooney up front gigs on the left etc same as its been for 15 years, i guess now that's out of the bag all three will be relegated.

[HammerTel]

Anyone can list a handful of statistics to skew any argument,ironic that the 10-1 aggregate was against a side that in the playoff final played good football with players bought on a shoestring and paid buttons for wages!
Ian Holloway is a Manager that used to believe in the long ball,he went around Europe and observed coaches in training sessions and came to the conclusion that he had to change his footballing philosophy and I certainly see Holloway getting back into the Premier League one way or another!

[VikeltAussie]

Blacpool 10-1 on aggregate

10-2 on agg with Blackpool, but I agree with all your points. I just can't wait for a victory over Arsenal to hear Wenger complaining

[phukethammer]

Ahhh the old West Ham Way chestnut.....

I remember in the Chicken run watching The West Ham way and us getting smashed at home by the likes of QPR and Charlton, so you can stick your West Ham Way up your jacksie.
Also seem to remember the father of the West Ham Way John lyall being hounded out of a job by his own supporters.

Allardyce deserves a medal for taking us up first time and it will be refreshing to see the looks on these teams faces when they have to finally fight against West Ham to get a result.

Well done Big Man!!

Disclaimer: These views are my own and do not represent half the miserable C**** that support West Ham United.

[HammerTel]

I raise you Cardiff,Aldershot Burnley and Ipswich,I dont see any references to "west ham way" or "John Lyall" i`ll wager you have periods of amnesia or dont get down the Boleyn that often!
I could easily cut and paste the newspaper reports of the insipid dross that got served up in much of the first 2 thirds of the season,not to mention the drawfests in the last third,but I wont do that cos no one likes a smart @rse!

[phukethammer]

I raise you Cardiff,Aldershot Burnley and Ipswich,I dont see any references to "west ham way" or "John Lyall" i`ll wager you have periods of amnesia or dont get down the Boleyn that often!
I could easily cut and paste the newspaper reports of the insipid dross that got served up in much of the first 2 thirds of the season,not to mention the drawfests in the last third,but I wont do that cos no one likes a smart @rse!

read your own posts because its your comments about percentage football and you quoted the "west ham way" so if the amnesia cap fits why not wear it...

[DaveWHU1964]

It`s funny when anyone ever dare`s question Sam Allardyce`s credentials the old chestnuts of Zola and Grant are mentioned,I have no idea why they are the yardstick,how about comparing Allardyce to Pardew?
I tend to look forward not back it cant have escaped many people`s attention that the Premier League is getting more and more technical with younger dynamic coaches/managers moving from the likes of Norwich/Swansea to Villa and Liverpool respectively,with Roberto Martinez looking destined for greener pastures, as well as the incredible job Pardew is doing at Newcastle!
The first 2 thirds of the season was pretty poor interspersed with some good performances,I was very dissapointed we practically binned both the cups at the first hurdle,we have a great cup tradition and if going out tamely to lower league opposition can be easily mitigated as we were "concentrating on promotion" then the same can be said as we look to grind our way to 40 point`s and safety,and to be frank it would be wholly unacceptable.
For those people who do live in the past quoting Zola and Grant,I feel Zola as a rookie boss clearly lacked that little bit of experience when we struggled,which could also have been said at times with Pardew it`s all part of the learning curve,I`m interested to know from the most loyal of Sam Allardyce`s fans how many points is he going to be superior to Zola at the end of the upcoming Premier League campaign?

You've confused me. You mention 'the old chestnuts of Zola and Grant' but it was you first who brought them up in the first place in your earlier post.

You mention that the first two thirds of the season was poor, but because it doesn't suit your arguments you don't acknowledge why that was. There was a necessary turnover of 45 players. 45. That's a huge amount. Do you really think that was ever going to allow this team to gel immediately? That's rarely how football works, and those who think it is have been reading too much 'Roy of the Rovers'. I personally find the 'we had such a great squad that we should have walked the league' brigade's argument amazingly simplistic. It seems to rely on the notion that a dis-spirited, relegated mess of a club can lose it's best two players, undertake a major rebuild and still 'click' from day one of the season. Like I said- 'Roy of the Rovers' stuff.

As for the cups- you can stick them this season. Birmingham fans might be thinking the same right now as well. Their club is in terrible financial troubles and memories of their excellent cup runs won't console them if their club has to be pared back further. Had we stayed down great cup runs wouldn't have mattered much if we then had to endure the financial cut-backs the club are now saying would have been made. Promotion was the be-all-and-end-all this season.

Finally tell me if I'm wrong. You're criticising him for not giving the cups a go. If we'd have won them both but stayed down would you have been happy or would you have come on here attacking him from a different angle saying 'it's all very well winning cups but his priority was the league so he failed'. If you say no I'll take your word for it, but there's plenty of others who would cos any old stick to beat him with will do.

[Up the Junction]

You've confused me.

May of had a turnover of players but we went up with the majority of the 1st team being here before sam turned up, so the amount of players in and out is not relevant.
It wasn't at the beginning of the season where we ddnt gel, it was after Xmas when sam had had 6 months with the players.
We can all pick parts of the season to make our arguments seem more valid, you say walking this league is Roy of the rovers stuff, yet we were only 3 points from being champions, If we had won half the games we drew yet lost he others we still would have finished top.
He sent the team out last season not to lose instead of going for the win, is is coincidence that the form and performances drastically improved at the end of the season after we had dropped out of the Auto promotion spot, while in he top 2 he was all about getting a point hopefully 3 not losing, where as Reading went for the wins.
After 29 games we were about 16 points clear of Reading, 19 point turnaround in under 19 games.Reading could easily have failed but they didn't because they had the bottle to go for the wins.

[DaveWHU1964]

Mywhufc

Not got a lot of time to answer your post unfortunately. I'm not dismissing all that you say but as for the amount of players in and out not being relevant? Are you being really being serious?

Also yes, three more points and we'd have won the league- you're right. But that's not walking it is it? And walking it is apparently something we should have done. And had we done that he still wouldn't be getting any credit cos after all we should have 'walked it' in any case.

Excuse me if I sound a tad peeved but i'm getting fed up having to defend our manager from our own fans on a thread with this title.

[miketheloop]

I just don't get people like mywhufc.

Every team of every league will have cracking games and play well, average games and draw, poor games and lose throughout a season. Football is a confidence game, we saw that at Cardiff first game of the season. All the players were still carrying last seasons burdens of being relegated and generally being spanked week in week out for the past two seasons.

I don't think anyone here sees Big Sam as the messiah (he's just a very naughty boy).

But what we do see is a football man who came in and turned the club around. You can can attack his tactics or style of play as much as you want but the players played at the end of the season with loads of confidence. Take the Cardiff semi finals, we took Cardiff apart, we turned under pressure and out played them, at their place too! You can say "oh Cardiff we're not good that day", but maybe that was because we made them look bad?

And then the final, yeah Blackpool did play better than us, we had it all to loose and they had everything to gain. After all everyone had us as odds on favourite.

But all that said and done, did you not see the Brighton game? When was the last time we won 6-0 in a league game and dominated the game? Come on, nobody's saying lick his arse, just appreciate what the guy did!

We could easily of become another Leeds, forest, Sheffield weds etc etc. but we're not, we're back in the prem with a decent manager. Who at times had us playing some decent football.

[richneal]

3. Lastly, other teams can read us like a book - they know how he'll line 'em up and know what our tactics will be.

Blacpool 10-1 on aggregate
Brighton 6-0
Nottingham 4-0
Watt ford 4-0
yep ,read us like a book

So - for instance - don't you think that Holloway had our number at Wembley then? Do you think we were lucky to nick a win? As for your other results - fair points made and all are duly noted. However, that doesn't mean my original point isn't valid. Think of all those draws that cost us automatic promotion. Think of all those late goals we conceded. How many points did we get from from Soton and Reading? Don't take my word for it - look at the stats for all of the above. I'd argue that many opposition managers read us like a book . . . They knew how we'd line up and play, and organised themselves accordingly. Again, I'd argue that's the reason so many of them got the points they wanted.

I can tell you how andwhat Man Cities, Arsenals and Man United line ups and tactics will be next year, it will be free flowing passing football looking to create space and opportunities for their forwards , Rooney up front gigs on the left etc same as its been for 15 years, i guess now that's out of the bag all three will be relegated.

No you can't. Sorry mate, but quoting what amounts to a shopping list of meaningless adjectives and descriptors ('free-flowing passing, create space, opportunities for forwards,' etc) doesn't even begin to represent tactical analysis. Now I'm not blaming you for that, or having a go at you, because you're only repeating what we hear most of the time from media pundits. But IMHO, when those pundits prattle on about stuff like that it's absolute meaningless dross . . . It's usually applied after the fact - ie., describing what has happened, post-match. Think of asking media pundits exactly where the goals will come from and why - before the match - and you'll get the idea. For the most part they're absolutely useless at predicting exactly what will happen and why.

In my earlier post that you partially quoted, the first thing I did was state that BFS deserved congratulations for what he did this season - he did well and deserves a pat on the back. Especially from punters like me. But as you know, our season was far from problem-free, with many raising what are thought to be valid concerns. I think those concerns remain valid, and I'm already looking forward to seeing how next season's version of 4-3-3 will actually line up mate . . .

[HammerTel]

Confused you surely not!
I reference Zola and Grant in respect that Sam Allardyce is always compared to them to show him in the best possible light,I mention that being an old chestnut as it has been mentioned on here 100`s if not 1000`s of times on this forum,I can only apologise if you didnt understand the context of my rhetorical question!
By the tone of your response I take it you will be in favour of another all out grind towards the safety mark of 40 points at the expense of any interest in the cups at all!
When did this shift of the ethos of West Ham fans take place where we were brainwashed into submission?
We are now prepared not to" dream" let alone having our dreams "fade and die" my reservations of Allardyce are in good faith and I dont think Sam`s way is the only way that`s all,as I`ve said before Zola failed in difficult circumstances,my guess is Allardyce may not make Christmas!

[HammerTel]

read your own posts because its your comments about percentage football and you quoted the "west ham way" so if the amnesia cap fits why not wear it...[/quote]



Phukethammer,
I was merely referencing the "old chestnuts" and "West Ham way" in order to make a point that they have been mentioned 1000`s of times ,it`s a contextual thing!
I am a bit worried about your amnesia though as if you are the Phukethammer on twitter then you mention in April that you wish we had employed Hughton and not Allardyce,which leads me to think Sam wont be on rock solid ground playing 4-5-1 should we get an early mauling!

[window74]

Ok just a few points from reading this thread!

Teams had us beaten did they as we only had one way of playing, hhhhhmmmm now this sounds like West Ham pre Big Sam in all honesty. We have several ways of playing now which can be seen in many of the draws which before Big Sam would have been defeats & don't even get me started on the 7 points from 9 from the games we finished with 10 men each in. We have become a bloody hard to beat for the most part, some teams next season are going to have quite the wake up call. Record amount of away wins & 3rd in the league & as you have said only 3 points from being champions, again none of that smacks of a team where everyone has our number.

The simple thing of last year is we were the team everyone wanted to beat & thusly raised their game accordingly, this season we will be the little fish in the big pond. Which will be nice as a huge amount of pressure is going to have been removed. We can only hope the boo boys stay away as half the reason we never walked the league is how pathetic some supposed fans were last year & who turned on the team after 10-15 minutes of games all because we were not already winning said games.

Sam, the 2 Davids, all the backroom staff & the playing squad deserve a huge amount of kudos & respect for what they did last season & so I will say it again proudly. Well done all & 1 & here is looking forward to the new season with a new found optimism I have not had before any season in quite some time!

[phukethammer]

read your own posts because its your comments about percentage football and you quoted the "west ham way" so if the amnesia cap fits why not wear it...

Phukethammer,
I was merely referencing the "old chestnuts" and "West Ham way" in order to make a point that they have been mentioned 1000`s of times ,it`s a contextual thing!
I am a bit worried about your amnesia though as if you are the Phukethammer on twitter then you mention in April that you wish we had employed Hughton and not Allardyce,which leads me to think Sam wont be on rock solid ground playing 4-5-1 should we get an early mauling![/quote]


ive no idea who phukethammer is on twitter, i suggest you reel yourself in a bit.....

[Dyer's Leg]

Dapablo. Has it not crossed your mind that all you need to do is go to your opening post at the start, click on edit, and change the title yourself?

His opening post shows the original title.

I was aware of that. But I also know that if he edited it and re-submitted the opening post, the title would revert.

As was proved.

Fail.

[dapablo]

By the tone of your response I take it you will be in favour of another all out grind towards the safety mark of 40 points at the expense of any interest in the cups at all!
When did this shift of the ethos of West Ham fans take place where we were brainwashed into submission?
We are now prepared not to" dream" let alone having our dreams "fade and die" my reservations of Allardyce are in good faith and I dont think Sam`s way is the only way that`s all,as I`ve said before Zola failed in difficult circumstances,my guess is Allardyce may not make Christmas!

Summary of the D word, lets base our football style on an old pop song about continual failure, it's all very sweet haveing a groovy tune no-one else has got but really results matter whenever I look at the history books and not the fact that bob from barking thought it boring, who cares even, poor old bob the world moves on and he's not even the centre of it.

Accepting reality is not being brainwashed it is being mature., of course he's not the only way but he just happens to be our way at the moment, give the team some of your love instead of your disain.